Super Lawyer

Tag: Internship

  • Raghu Ram, Founder and CEO, Law Abode LPO, on his startup, and the challenges of starting your own venture

    Raghu Ram, Founder and CEO, Law Abode LPO, on his startup, and the challenges of starting your own venture

    Raghu Ram completed his graduation from Jagarlamudi Chandramouli College of Law, Guntur in 2005. He then went on to purse his MBA from University of Central Queensland (Australia).  He is the CEO and founder of Law Abode LPO. He has more than thirteen years of experience in business development and legal operations management. Prior to this he has worked at Acumen LPO and Pegasys LPO.

    In this interview he talks about:

    • Legal skills required to work in LPO;
    • About his startup Law Abode LPO;
    • Challenges of starting your own venture.

    HOW WOULD YOU LIKE TO INTRODUCE YOURSELF TO OUR READERS?

    I would like to introduce myself as Founder & CEO of Law Abode LPO, a boutique legal outsourcing firm catering legal and technical services to American and Canadian Attorneys. Over the past six years I have been running the firm. At the age of 29 I started Law Abode LPO. Prior to this I worked with two startups as a legal and business consultant. I am self-motivated guy who believes in hard work. I got my B.A. LL.B from Jagarlamudi Chandramouli College of Law, Guntur in the year 2005 and M.B.A from Central Queensland University, Australia in the year 2007. I take care of business development and legal operations of the firm.

     

    PLEASE TELL US ABOUT YOUR COLLEGE LIFE?

    My college days are unforgettable. Those days are the happiest days of my life. In college, I met two important persons of my life. I have learned a lot from my principal (Dr. Sudhakara Babu). He is my guide and mentor even today. He is my backbone and like my father. Another person is my wife (Jaya Lakshmi), now she is working as Judge in AP Judiciary. I was very proactive student in the college with good academics. Not only academics, I participated in cultural, sports and all other activities held in college. I was the college topper and secured awards for meritorious performance in university exam. I gave paper presentation at national level symposiums and was a regular participant in college debates and moot courts. I believe college life has a great impact on me in shaping my career.

     

    YOU PURSUED MBA FROM UNIVERSITY OF CENTRAL QUEENSLAND AFTER LLB. WHY THE DECISION TO PURSUE MBA AFTER LLB?

    The main reason to pursue MBA after LLB is to get different combination. In early 2000 I heard about LPO and outsourcing concepts. There were debates about foreign law firms entering to India. That time I thought in this changing global scenario Law and Management combination will definitely give me good career. A law and MBA degree helps professionals build expertise in either field, for example, marketing in management, or litigation in law. But in a rapidly globalising economy, a combination could take one’s career much further. And, given the demand for a combination of law and MBA qualifications, this dual combination helped me lot to start my own firm, because I have knowledge in legal services and I know how to market these services.

     

    WHAT IS THE WORK PROFILE OF A LEGAL CONSULTANT AT AN LPO?

    My first work profile was of  legal and business consultant; I was part of both business development and legal operations. Work profile for the legal consultant depends upon the LPO firm. Some of the LPOs offer only contract management services and some of them offer personal injury services. Now most of the big LPO firms primer service is contract management and document review. Normal job of legal consultant would be doing the legal research, preparing legal memos, contract drafting, contract review, its mostly attorney supporting work.

     

    COULD YOU EXPLAIN TO OUR YOUNG READERS WHAT IS AN LPO AND WHAT ARE THE TASKS UNDERTAKEN BY IT?

    Legal process outsourcing (LPO) is new concept. Its part of KPO (Knowledge process outsourcing). Most of them think it’s also something like BPO. But it’s absolutely wrong. In BPO person’s qualifications and subject knowledge is not much required. But in LPO it is different. If anyone wants to work in LPO, they should have law degree for most of the work. Basically in LPO firms, most of the work would be legal support services, legal research, legal drafting, contract drafting, contract review, personal injury claim matters, e-discovery, preparing bankruptcy chapters, intellectual property matters. These are the main tasks LPOs are taking right now.

     

    WE HAVE HEARD THE LPO WORK GETS REPETITIVE AND THERE IS LIMITED GROWTH IN THE SAME? IS IT TRUE OR WOULD YOU LIKE TO DISPEL THIS WIDESPREAD OPINION ABOUT THIS CAREER CHOICE?

    Yes, LPO work gets repetitive. Because you are working with attorneys, they have every day paper work. As long as they are in regular practice we will receive work. It’s the beauty of the industry; I have close to ten years of work association with some of my clients. It’s all about trust building with your quality work. Once you are accustomed to their way of work, it is really happy to work with. I am completely disagreeing with your opinion about career growth, there is huge scope of career growth, with in span of 10 years one can reach to good position in LPO sector. We will have lot of exposure about international market and foreign legal issues. In terms of salary wise also LPOs are giving good packages.

     

    HOW DID YOU DECIDE TO START YOUR OWN VENTURE? WHAT WERE THE CHALLENGES INVOLVED?

    I started my own firm when I was 29. After four years of real time experience and witnessing a few key moments of work culture led me to start my own firm. Since my wife is into judicial services, she use to have a transfer in every three years. This is also one of the reasons to start my own venture. Now I have comfort to work from any place and I can make the decisions on my own. There are challenges involved running LPO firm. The biggest challenge is convincing the client and getting work from them. It’s really a herculean task. We can convenience the attorney only with quality of work. If you research is less than perfect, its no use. Timely delivery of the projects and resource availability are major concern. Firms like us, we are working in tier two cities, and availability of resources is less as compare to metros. W get good resources in metro cities but it’s difficult to get in small places.

     

    WHAT ARE THE LEGAL SKILLS REQUIRED TO BE WORKING IN AN LPO?

    LPO is perceived as an alternative career option for lawyers. LPO provides an attractive alternative to legal professionals, offering them higher salaries, work-life balance and better working conditions. Working with foreign attorneys always a tough call. We need to adapt to their way of working and usage of technology. Lawyers who want to work in LPO need have good command over the english language and legal analytical skills. Lawyers are required to be well versed with the legal procedural differences including expertise in online legal databases.

     

    DOES LAW ABODE LPO OFFER INTERNSHIPS TO LAW STUDENTS? HOW CAN A LAW STUDENT APPLY FOR THE SAME?

    Yes, we offer internships to selected students. Students can send their information to email: info@lawabodelpo.com

     

    WHAT SKILLS AND QUALITIES WOULD YOU LOOK FOR IN ANY LAWYER BEFORE OFFERING HIM A JOB WITH YOUR LPO?

    I strongly believe that there is no substitute for hard work. Working in legal profession whether its regular legal practice, working in corporate legal department or working in LPO, lawyers need have lot of patience. They should be ready to work long hours. The skill-set we see in resources is mainly their communication, use of online tools, understanding about legal issues, research skills and their academics.

     

    WHAT WOULD BE YOUR WORD OF ADVICE TO YOUNG LAWYERS AND LAW STUDENTS?

    I personally believe, working in legal profession is always challenging. Every day is new task. Particularly for law students, they have lot of career opportunities like judicial services, corporate legal departments, traditional court practice and working LPO sector. It better to have clear goal in which they want to go. Basing on that they have to upgrade required skill set. It’s always better to participate in moot courts and debates to enhance their speaking skills. In changing global scenario they have to observe latest trends in legal market. Use of online tools and technology always has an advantage to do the things faster.

     

  • Pooja Reddy Chirra, Proprietor, C.Subba Reddy Co. Advocates and Consultants, shares her experience on managing her own firm

    Pooja Reddy Chirra, Proprietor, C.Subba Reddy Co. Advocates and Consultants, shares her experience on managing her own firm

    Pooja Reddy Chirra completed her graduation from Fergusson College, Pune University in 2014. She is currently managing her own firm  and her area of expertise is indirect taxation. She is actively involved in litigation of IDT matters.

    In this interview we speak to her about:

    • Challenges of managing her own firm
    • Importance of academics and grades
    • How to convert internships to PPO

     

     

    HOW WOULD YOU LIKE TO INTRODUCE YOURSELF TO OUR READERS? PLEASE TELL US SOMETHING ABOUT YOUR PRE-COLLEGE LIFE?

    I am 26 year-old Hyderabadi who is Mumbaikar by heart, an advocate by day and dramatic all the time! I specialise in Indirect Taxation and currently run my own firm, but I am more than my job description. I work with the Rotary Club of Bombay Powai, who were kind enough to let me organise the ‘Unsung Hero Show’ which has played a huge role in helping me do things which I would otherwise be too scared to take up. I also started organising etiquette workshops in 2015, focusing mainly on schools and colleges with students majorly from low income families.

    My pre-college life was simple, protected and uncomplicated, like most other kids at the time. My brother and I were raised by a set of no-nonsense parents who moved to Mumbai nearly 35 years ago and built the life they have today, with no help from anyone else whatsoever. We were both sent to Kendriya Vidhyalaya, IIT, Powai. Mainly because I had started to demand luxuries, like a chauffeur and a full time maid to cater my every need (I was six!). My parents always were very conscious about us being humble and modest, and so, Government School it was.

     

    HOW WOULD YOU DESCRIBE YOUR JOURNEY AS A LAWYER?

    Back in 2014, right after I graduated from college, I joined my father’s firm. Two weeks after I started, my dad had cardiac arrest and was hospitalised. Things got tense. My mother told me that if I wanted to help, the only thing I could do is to take care of work so that he won’t have to worry about it. I was beyond overwhelmed because I had no idea who half of our clients were and I had zero experience in the subject. During that time, when my father was still in the ICU, one family member lectured me in the ICU waiting area, saying that if I wanted my father to get better I should get married, preferably to a lawyer, so that he can take care of dad’s firm. It hit me then that in his eyes I had failed even before I attempted. Those words stuck me ever since and has been one of the reasons I so desperately want to make something of myself in the field of law. Fortunately, my parents were far more sensible and supportive. My father trained me in the strictest way possible, in the years that followed, we set a rhythm to our work, he did advisory and I did litigation, he would deal with the clients and I did the running around, we took turns taking vacation and we always had each other’s back.

    I realised later that during those few months when dad was ill, the kind of work I was doing was intense. I was appearing before various authorities without ever having accompanied a senior to observe how the proceedings are conducted. Of-course, it helped a great deal that my father prepped me well. But in those few months, my interest in the subject peaked and all inhibitions disappeared and I started to understand the subject instead of being afraid of it. After that there was no looking back.

     

    WHAT IS YOUR TAKE ON ACADEMICS? HOW IMPORTANT ARE GRADES IN LAW SCHOOL FOR AN ILLUSTRIOUS CAREER?

    Academics and grades are important, but it is not sufficient. Simply because you score well in school or college, will not ensure a lifetime of illustrious career. Definitely not in the field of law.

    Your clients will come to you for your work ethic, your knowledge, sometimes even your honesty and compassion. Similarly, in a corporate office, your boss will not continue to keep you employed because you scored well in college, if you can’t get the work done.

     

    HOW FAR DID YOUR INTERNSHIPS DURING LAW SCHOOL HELP YOU IN YOUR CAREER AFTER YOUR GRADUATION? HOW WOULD YOU RECOMMEND THE PRESENT LAW STUDENTS PLAN THEIR INTERNSHIPS?

    I interned during every college vacation, either with a counsel or with a firm. But the biggest mistake I made was to plan on what I intended to learn during the internship, and like most other law students, I tried to cram as many internships. The end result was that, I was once actually caught sleeping on the sofa by a Senior Counsel. Fortunately, he was nice enough to simply say, “go nap at the corner cubicle where no one can see you, so that others don’t get sleepy.”

    Regardless, internships can do no harm, if you pay even the slightest bit of attention to your surroundings, you are bound to learn something or the other, whether you want to or not. However, one bit of advice to every student, would be to do long term internships. Instead of doing one month internships, opt for one, three-month internship. You’ll end up learning way more and also increase chances of a PPO.

    And, at the end, pick a boss, not a job.

     

    HOW DID YOU CHOOSE YOUR SPECIALIZATION? HOW DID YOU GO ABOUT ATTAINING EXPERTISE IN THEM?

    I didn’t chose my specialisation, my specialisation chose me.

    *dramatic pause*

    In all seriousness, I actually never wanted to take up Indirect Taxation. In fact, during the first year or so of law college, I wanted to graduate and immediately become a famous, dramatic criminal lawyer or become a savvy corporate lawyer with a huge pay package. (Yes, I blame the movies and shows too.)

    It was only after I started working on Indirect Tax cases, that I realised how interesting they were. There is constant change in the law, which keeps you on the toes. Each case is so beautifully different from the next. And in most cases you’re dealing with hyper technicalities, which can be extremely fun to research on.

    HOW CHALLENGING IS THE TASK OF RUNNING YOUR OWN FIRM? WHAT ARE YOUR ROLES AND RESPONSIBILITIES?

    I wouldn’t say it was easy.

    I lost my father on 10th August, 2017. He died so suddenly that even till today it is hard for us to believe that he isn’t around. The day after we cremated him, I started getting calls from my office and a few clients even I also got news of people trying to poach clients. I went back to work on 12th August and we immediately went into survival mode. Apart from my support staff, I have two colleagues with me, Arjun Nair and Vinit Dubey. They have proved to be the best team one could ask for. My dad’s death was a huge loss for them too, but they never took a day off. For several months, we worked seven days a week and twelve to fourteen hours a day.

    During the first few weeks I spent most of my time speaking to clients who were worried about the fate of their case. Several clients showed a lot of faith in us and stayed back, no questions asked. Some needed a little more persuasion.

    What was more interesting, was to see how most people were more curious about whether I would continue to work, since I was recently married and what would happen if I had babies? There were a few others who told me that since everyone at the office was below the age of 30, we were too young to do this kind of work. And all this made us work even harder. Today it has been a little more than eight months and we are doing good. The initial fear of losing clients and not being able to pay the bills and salaries has gone down the drain, we have got new clients as well.

    Through all of this, on several occasions I felt like closing the firm. It was emotionally and physically gruelling. While, my mother, brother, aunt, uncle and husband proved to be the best cheerleading squad one could ask for, I was more than fortunate to have Balani Sir, Krishnakumar Sir, Anish Desai and a few others encouraging me to continue. If it weren’t for them, maybe I wouldn’t have continued with this office.

    I would still say that this is my father’s firm, that he built on his own with the help of my mother. It is his legacy that he has passed on to me and right now I am only a guardian. Only after I build it further and scale it, I can truly call it my own firm.

     

    WHAT WOULD BE YOUR ADVISE TO STUDENTS WHO ARE LOOKING TO MAKE A CAREER IN INDIRECT TAX?

    Don’t be afraid of the subject. Once you start getting a grip of it, it becomes an addiction.

     

    WHAT ARE THE SKILLS ONE NEEDS TO DEVELOP TO SUCCEED IN THE LEGAL PROFESSION?

    Be a good orator, learn to listen carefully, be ethical in your work and read like your life depends on it.

     

    WHAT IS THE PROCEDURE FOR A LAW STUDENT TO APPLY FOR INTERNSHIP AT YOUR FIRM? HOW DO YOU SUGGEST THE STUDENTS CONVERT THEIR INTERNSHIPS TO PPO??

    Anyone who wishes to apply either for internship or a job can simply send us an email at subbareddyandco@gmail.com.

    If you want to convert your internship into a PPO, do the following:

    • Work on your research skills.
    • Be proactive. Don’t constantly wait for instructions.
    • Don’t be tardy.

     

    HOW DO YOU KEEP YOURSELF UPDATED WITH LATEST LEGAL DEVELOPMENTS IN THE FIELD OF TAXATION CONSIDERING THE CONSTANT CHANGES?

    For indirect taxation, there are weekly journals that are published, which my dad would read regularly. I picked up the habit from him.

    Also, we live in a world today, where for every activity and for every group of people, there is a WhatsApp group. The CESTAT Bar Association also keeps up with this trend. On a regular basis, there are advocates who keep posting the latest amendments and judgements on the group, which is followed by an insightful discussion on the same where everyone weighs in their opinions.

    The ‘Chai Pe Charcha’ sessions outside the courtroom while we each wait for our matters to come up, also helps us stay updated.

     

    YOU ARE CURRENTLY PURSUING YOUR MASTERS, HOW IMPORTANT IS IT TO GET A MASTER’S DEGREE IF YOU’RE PURSUING A CAREER IN LITIGATION?

    If you want to practice in courts and focus on litigation, what matters the most is that you start appearing in courts as soon as possible and as often as possible. All your learning will happen in a court room and court room training is irreplaceable. Spending two more years in a classroom after finishing law, may not be of much use.

    However, if you want to broaden your sphere of knowledge, then it would help to do an online course while you’re working. You could be a lawyer by day and a student by night. Just make sure you pick a university / course where examination is application based and not purely theoretical.

     

    LASTLY, WHAT WOULD BE YOUR PARTING MESSAGE TO OUR READERS?

    Truly learn to enjoy your life in college and don’t be stuck in the library, since most of the real learning happens outside of it anyway.

    Spend more time to develop life skills and long lasting relationships instead of trying to memorise the contents of the books enlisted in your syllabus.

    Experiment, learn, make mistakes and grow.

     

  • Rahul Phukan, Legal Director/Head Director of Legal-Real Estate, on his achievements and experiences from a graduate to director

    Rahul Phukan, Legal Director/Head Director of Legal-Real Estate, on his achievements and experiences from a graduate to director

    Rahul Phukan graduated from University Law College, Bangalore University (2000-2005). At present, he is leading legal real estate (Legal Director/Head of Legal-Real Estate) and expanding stores across in India and other countries in South Asia and managing a team of experienced lawyers based on regional offices in India for the purpose of procuring, development, opening and operation of stores in India.

     

    In this interview he talks to us about:

    • His experience at internships.
    • His career graph.
    • Qualities that helped him to become the head of legal-real estate.
    • Changes in life after becoming the head of legal-real estate.

     

    How did you choose law? Did you always know that this was what you wanted to do?

    I made up my mind to pursue law pretty early in life- may be around standard eight in school. There were certainly influences in my formative years from the family. The tales of my great grandfather being a pioneer in the field of law and one of the first Indian district court judge in north-east of India (Larger Assam State including East Bengal under British). There were lawyers in the next generation who were also academicians and experts. The generation after had my uncle who was a Supreme Court judge with whom I had spent quite a bit of time- I think enough time to get influenced and convinced! I remember, the family house in Jorhat, Assam, had a library- though I didn’t read much from there but just glancing through the books perhaps also left a mark and fascinated me. Having said that, no one in the family ever told me that I should pursue law, I think the influences were strong enough to shape my decision which my parents definitely appreciated and supported.

    Adding to that, though I knew I would do law for sure, but what would I specialise in was something I was not sure of. But I still pursued it with an intention that I will explore and find my area of interest.

     

    Tell us something about your college life. Which activities did you participate in? How did you go about developing expertise and knowledge in your areas of interest?

    I am a proud alumni of University Law College,Bangalore. At college we had the liberty to participate in various moot court competitions which I thought was a great way to develop research and analytical skills. I also made it a point that I interned with various lawyers and law firms. I started my internship right from the second year in college. I was fortunate to have the opportunity to spend time with a leading national law firm after college each day. When I look back I realise that the internships which I did gave me a very practical overview of the legal field and by working on various subjects, I could actually test the water and decide what I wanted to do on a long term basis. Besides this, I also made it a point to visit courts every now and then and witness the working of the judiciary. I feel this is important no matter which field of law one chooses -at least to have some knowledge of the courts! As a student, one gets  extremely inclined to certain subjects like IPR, Corporate Laws, Human Rights, etc. but it is the practical experience which helps one to decide where one’s interest lies and sometimes also to discover that the interest is actually on a totally different subject.

    Apart from the extra- curricular activities, interaction with my teachers in class, discussion with peers and seniors in college were something which really helped me understand the legal field better and understand the practicalities. Academically, as a student I was one of the top five rank holders in the University.

    While it is important to enhance expertise and knowledge, it is equally important to have a life beyond college, internships and extra-curricular activities. I continued doing what I always enjoyed doing i.e. play tennis and cricket, read books and listen to music and attend various concerts and events. The idea was to have the right balance of academics and life in general- making both enjoyable!

     

    Many lawyers say that the first year after graduation is the most difficult year for young lawyers. How was your first year after graduation?

    Yes, I agree for many the first year after graduation is a difficult year. There are numerous colleges in India where in the final year there is no campus placement if one has to opt to work for the corporate world or a renowned law firm.

    For me there was a period of dilemma right around the time I was about to complete my law graduation and few months after. I was unsure on the course of action I should take, though I was certain that I had to work for a corporate eventually. I quickly learnt that to excel in any role I take up, it was important to understand and acquire practical knowledge in the field I like- so as to become an expert in that field. This is when I started applying for law firms as I thought that to learn or experience all verticals of law there is no better place than a law firm. I am glad I was retained by Fox Mandal & Associates as a trainee and for the exposure I got to various aspects of laws – which most certainly helped me shape my career!

     

    What kind of internships did you do while you were a student? Any remarkable experiences during your internships that shaped your career choices later?

    I must tell you that internships are as important as academics. The more internships or time you spend observing the legal fraternity, the easier it is to make career choices. It is like a discovery trip!

    Right from the second year of college, I made it a point to do formal internships or just spend time every day with law firms or at an advocate’s chamber. My internships were mainly on corporate law practices including FDI, corporate compliance-labour laws and IPR. It involved civil litigation and real estate transactions. While interning with a law firm in Bangalore, I got the first taste of working on the real estate domain which I started to enjoy. What was fascinating for me was that the domain had variety of challenges on a day-to-day level. The number of legislations one is going through for any real estate transaction could vary with the location, ownership, etc. and each real estate project had its own uniqueness and set of challenges- I was intrigued!

     

    You have a lot of work experience, from working at a vast array of places. Can you tell us a little about your career graph up to this point?

    After college in 2005, I started as a Trainee at Fox Mandal & Associates in Bangalore. Fox Mandal as you may be aware is a full service law firm and hence as a trainee I was fortunate to work on the job with all verticals in the firm which was very intense and a great learning experience. During this time, I interacted a lot with various partners and industry experts to learn more and more about each work-stream practically.

    I continued as an Associate at Fox Mandal Bangalore and joined the real estate and infrastructure team. In the year 2009, I was promoted as a Senior Associate and subsequently, in the year 2010, I was escalated as the Group Head of the Real Estate and Infrastructure Wing at Fox Mandal & Associates, Bangalore. During the course of my retainer-ship with Fox Mandal, I was handling matters relating to real estate and property and had worked with various developers, Indian and international corporate/companies, financial institutions, property management groups/consultants, foreign state government/bodies. The matters mostly involved entry level strategy planning, due diligence, joint ventures, M&A, joint development, project construction and development, facility/built-to-suit campus development, pre/post lease/purchase/sale compliance & documentation(residential & commercial properties) and of course litigation and corporate law support.

    Thereafter, in 2012, I joined Goldman Sachs in Bangalore as Legal Associate for the Corporate Real Estate Legal (CREL) and Commercial and Corporate Contract– Asia Pacific except Japan. My role in Goldman Sachs involved providing legal support to conduct real estate matters, e.g., real estate transactions including investments, capital projects, building operations, critical systems and infrastructure and was also responsible for periodic regulatory, corporate entity reporting and corporate matters related to real estate entities. Further, I did review and draft a wide variety of corporate services and other contracts including: events, travel, technology, consultant, tax & audit engagement letters, market data, subscription, employment, training, procurement and vendor contract and related matters and advised on matters, in collaboration with divisional and other specialist lawyers. Not to forget, my work also involved management of internal corporate authorizations and procedural matters and legal issues as they arise in day-to-day activities.

    In December 2014, I joined Decathlon Sports India Limited as Real Estate Legal Advisor for the South Zone and later in September 2015, I took over as the Head of Legal/Legal Director- Real Estate.

     

    You are the head of legal-real estate. What qualities helped you to achieve this status?

    To start with, the most important quality is the passion for the field of Real Estate Law.  The passion does drive me to learn each day and come back greedier to work for more. Of course, one has to be hard working and dedicated to ensure that each work stream is done with 100% commitment and integrity. There is no short-cut to gain practical experience, so the more one efficiently works on various fields with an open mind, the bigger the gain is in terms of experience. I also enjoy interacting with people and in that sense I am quite observant as a person too- this helps me a lot in business relationships and negotiations.

    Right from my days at the law firm, I was leading a team- hence leadership and managerial qualities was a key quality as well. Today I lead a team of extremely able and competent lawyers at Decathlon. Also, the nature of work I do involves lot of decision making- hence I would say managerial courage is important too.

     

    Tell us about the nature of work you are entrusted with at Decathlon Sports India Private Limited.

    Decathlon Sports  is one of the biggest sports retailers and is rapidly growing in India. I lead the legal real estate team at Decathlon. The team is primarily involved with the business and development team right from sourcing of projects to opening of stores in India. There is a variety of legal issues one has to go through including but not limited to property laws for any given projects and as you may be aware that real estate is a complex subject with laws varying from state to state.

    I am also helping certain other regions in Asia for legal matter and store openings, has been one of my expertise.

     

    What changes came into your life after becoming the legal director / Head of legal-real estate? How do you manage to strike a balance between your professional and personal life?

    For me the change is not drastic- I still continue to enjoy the work I do like I always did. Of course, there is a lot more to handle now, but when one organises work based on the priority and business requirement with the support of an extremely efficient, competent and motivated team, the work flow can be channelized. Since, there is a variety of projects across regions; I do travel now quite a bit now.

    As a young lawyer, it was difficult to manage the work and life balance as we all want to learn and excel quickly. As one grows older- and with experience it is easier to find that balance between work and life to sustain the career growth and to continue and keep the hunger to learn without risking a burn out. Therefore, dedicating time for the family and friends who are my support system especially on the weekends, doing things I like, playing sports when I can is something which really brings that balance. I am also a foodie who likes to eat and cook and I love travelling or going out for drives- I find these things really relaxing and refreshing. Without this facet of life, one cannot get the best out at the workplace- home is where the heart is as they say!

     

    What are your plans for the future?

    I plan to continue working as a real estate lawyer for sure. Perhaps, I would also like to stretch my wings to the other regions out of Asia- which I really enjoy. What would be also interesting is, apart from being a transactional and business lawyer, to go beyond legal aspects and contribute more to the organisation I am associated with. Definitely, the lawyer in me helps me to be that business partner and the risk manager!

     

    What would be your message to our readers who are budding lawyers and law students?

    From my experience, I would say that while it is very important to excel academically, it is even more important to experience the legal field from practical point of view. At the beginning, one has to be patient and must only concentrate on the learning and experience. While job tile and remuneration is important but it is not bigger than knowledge- so if a young lawyer is open to learning and only concentrates on harnessing his/her legal skills at the beginning of the career- I can assure you that job title and remuneration shall all fall into place on the long run. Efficiency in work, practical knowledge, transactional experience, managerial and decision making skills are few things no law school can teach!

    Not to forget, while we are all focussed on our career goals- never stop doing things you like doing apart from work or studies or internships. The balance between hard work and life will make the journey complete and enjoyable.

    My good wishes to all budding lawyers- the legal profession is seeing immense change and the younger generation is clearly blending in well and pushing the standards higher.

    All the best and thank you for having me!

     

     

     

  • Abheek Saha, Amrit Lal Saha & Associates, on building a career in Investment Law

    Abheek Saha, Amrit Lal Saha & Associates, on building a career in Investment Law

    Abheek Saha graduated from M.S. Ramaiah College of Law, Bangalore (2007-2012). With a passion towards investment, he started investing at the age of 16 in the Indian stock market. Later, after the RBI rules were liberalized, started investing in the currency market. With a special interest in Investment laws, during the college days,he concentrated on the various changes – developments of Indian and foreign investment laws, arbitration, investment arbitration, Consumers Protection, Competition laws, etc.

     In this interview, he talks to us about

    • His experience at M.S. Ramaiah College of Law.
    • How did he develop a special interest in Investment Law.
    • His experience as a fresh graduate.
    • Important factors students should keep in mind while building their potential career graphs.

    How would you introduce yourself? Can you please share a little bit of what motivated you to pursue law as a career?

    Law was never a second choice for me. It was always first. The decision to pursue law may be because of both my personal interest and having already seen my father practice for many years.

    Like all 11th – 12th standard school students deciding on a career in law, I too searched for all the various places a law graduate can work after passing out of law college, and the search results the law firm, companies, or in the field of litigation broadly. The prospects looked good and that validated further my interest in law.

    Kindly acquaint us with your college life. What activities you were involved in apart from regular academic curriculum?

    I was in M.S. Ramaiah College of Law, Bangalore, and mostly stayed in hostel all through the 5 years and really lived the hostel life. Among all, the Ramaiah hostel was little exception with limited restriction on movement in the night and thus could explore Bangalore during those hours.

    Sports were quite limited and I only used to go for early morning basketball with hostelites near the Ramaiah Degree college and sometimes for the table tennis after classes in the old college building. Our college building shifted to a new one when we were in final year.

    Moot court was never part of our curriculum except during practical- the final two years. But I took special interest in them and in my second year participated in the Manfred Lachs Space Law Moot court competition – the ISRO funding round (NLSIU, Bangalore) and was really happy to see my Speaker score there. This was indeed my first moot court outside college. I also participated in Justice B R Sawhney Moot Court competition at NALSAR Hyderabad. I believe participating in these competition have broadened by research skills and also how to read, interpret and understand law during early days of law college. Apart from these two I have also participated in various intra and inter college competitions. We were Runners-up in ‘Mooting for Success’ organized by Law Department, Garden City College in 2010. My friend Satabish Ajjarapu who is presently a lawyer in Vizag was my Co-Speaker.

    How did you develop a special interest in Investment Laws? Did you have other areas of law that interested you? How did you ultimately choose your field of work?

    Investment related field was always my interest not only during law college days but from my school days. I used to do trading in stock market, later in currency market. So during law college there was a natural affinity towards investment laws. I have also completed a Diploma in Securities & Investment Laws from IIL, Bangalore.

    Presently through our law firm Amrit Lal Saha& Associates, we are advising lot of start-up companies, venture with really beautiful ideas through their conceptual stage to their growth stage. And Bengaluru being one of the best Start-up hub in the world, we get lot of such venture as our client. Sometimes we also cut down on our professional fees to help venture on their legal requirements and to see them in existence and thus enabling these companies and venture grow. As these companies are not all pursuing the same idea, dream and thus their requirements are quite different and these provides us the challenges and the drive to keep going.

    How can I learn to invest in the Indian stock market?

    I may not be the best person to answer this question. I don’t do it any more though. But on a general note I believe everyone can learn doing it.

    Is it a general assumption that the fresher graduates have to struggle a lot during the initial years, what was your experience?

    Struggle is an inevitable part of this profession and during initial years the struggle is definitely more. I believe the decision to pursue law as a career should not be driven by news, knowledge about how much a person is earning after passing out of law school and law colleges but by real passion in this field. I have seen Times of India publishing news about how good the placement was in NLSIU, Bangalore and then students taking decision to study law. At no cost this should be driving the decision to study law as it is not just another profession. Because long hours and focused determination and a desire to move on in the face of adversity, criticism shall bring success in this field.A famous saying of Justice Joseph Story which my father keeps reiterating “Law is a jealous mistress, and requires a long and constant courtship. It is not to be won by trifling favours, but by a lavish homage”. I believe the saying still holds goods but yes now we have lot more resources and a better faster way to search save them which helps the lawyer a lot in the profession.

    I started my career with working at Bhasin & Co., New Delhi. I was very excited then as I had my first interaction in that office with Mr Lalit Bhasin himself who had directed his Partner to conduct interview for me. It was rare to get through the firm without any reference and thus having got an offer to work there without any such references I was more happy. Eventually I have quit the firm due to personal obligations and have started on my own, firstly as a Co-Founder and Legal Counsel of a company and then as a part of Amrit Lal Saha& Associates. Now we have a good client base and things look good from here. But we had our share of struggle and our effort still continues to make things better.

    Tell us about your approach towards the long term and the short term goals you had set during the academic period and how were you able to manage it?

    Our priorities change with changing circumstances and thus I would say not all short term goals were met but slowly working towards accomplishing the long term goals. And it is those long term goals which ultimately decides our working and engaging strategies.

    Considering the nature and importance of this profession what according to you should be the focus of the law students at the law schools? What are the important factors which students should keep in mind while building their potential career graphs?

    I would say students should not be very specific during early college days about corporate or litigation or any other field but should intern and gain understanding of each such field and thus explore. 5 years college time which is a long time and the last 2 years can be spent focusing on the specific sector where they would start working.

    You have several publications to your credit! How do you choose when to write about what? Do you think research and publishing is very important for a law student?

    I have always written only in my areas of interest and choosing a topic I believe becomes easy when a person is keeping track of the changing laws and how it is evolving.

    I won’t say it is very important to write but definitely when a law student writes it helps somewhere and he can also keep track of how the law is evolving.

    Where do you see yourself ten years from now?

    Everyone sets goal and even I have done for myself. In brief I would like to see the firm grow and we are able to address larger issues and clientele.

    What is your parting advice to our readers?

    For law students I will advise not to have a frozen goal for yourself but a dynamic one because we are social engineers and the law changes as the society changes and so should we.

     

  • Pranit Saxena, Founder, lawyerouno.com, on being a Manager at Tata Consultancy Services

    Pranit Saxena, Founder, lawyerouno.com, on being a Manager at Tata Consultancy Services

    Pranit Saxena graduated from Symbiosis Law School in 2011. He currently works with TCS as a Manager in the BFSI-LPS sphere. He is part of the core team setting up GRC expert augmentation for an EU based clearing bank. The task involves the staffed GRC experts assisting the chief compliance officer with BFSI specific compliance across EU, APAC and Americas.

    Pranit is also the founder of lawyerouno.com. Lawyerouno is a social venture that helps clients contact and make appointments with any lawyer for free. It searches the most appropriate lawyer per the client’s needs.

     In this interview he talks to us about:

    • His experience at Symbiosis Law School.
    • Importance of higher studies for a lawyer.
    • com- where clients contact and make appointments with any lawyer for free.
    • His views on international financial situation owing to upcoming regulations and situations.

    Please introduce yourself to our readers, where did you grow up and complete your initial education? How did you decide to take up law?

    Hi, I am Pranit. I am currently working with TCS setting up their international compliance practice. My initial education was across six cities including Bathinda, Nagpur, Pithoragarh, Noida, Pune etc. in Army Public schools and Kendriya Vidhayalas owing to my dad being in the forces. After a lot shunting, I finally passed my 12th from Noida. I decided to take up law based on my discussions with my teachers in school and my penchant for getting in trouble with the system (school system i.e. repeatedly getting in trouble with the school administration) and I guess it had worked out fine till now.

    You have graduated with BBA LLB Degree from Symbiosis Law School in 2011. Tell us about your law school experience. Share some highlights from your college days that shaped you as a lawyer.

    So Symbiosis back in 2006 was unlike any other law school that you would see right now. We had a limited campus, amazing faculty and even a better ecosystem of students from various fields (symbiosis law school was in the arts and commerce campus). This heterogeneity of students gave us a very early exposure to variety of disciplines and opportunities. It was rightly called the Oxford of the East, as the student community in Pune was very strong. They were perineal college festivals, competitions that used to go on and provided me ample opportunities to explore. Symbiosis Pune had no hostel in the campus and we used to live independently in the city, which was a huge learning in itself. The teachers came from a varied background and were very supportive and encouraging. Apart from the obvious knowledge, what Symbiosis uniquely provides every student, is the independent attitude and a corporate ready culture, which most of us would learn post our law school.

    Did you do any internship? What was the work allotted to you like?

    I completed 24 weeks of internship across law firms like Barucha, fox mandal, companies like Larson & Tubro and Supreme Court attorneys like P.P. Rao. The spectrum covered was intentionally larger to experience a variety of fields within the legal industry. The work allocated was usually around the research projects in law firms, case file summarization in Supreme Court and high courts and occasional arbitration work for L&T. The work also included being a part of the client/vendor meetings with the seniors and keeping a note of issues.

    How did you manage internship with studies? How did the practical exposure compliment the theoretical knowledge imparted to you in college?

    Back then in Symbiosis, internships were only allowed during breaks, which made sure there was never and conflict and balancing the internships with the mandatory attendance requirement was never a challenge.

    The court internships really helped in enhancing the nuances of the procedural laws which helped appreciate the theoretical knowledge.

    There is a huge gap between what we study and what we implement as lawyers in practice. With that being said, all the knowledge and experience in college forms a very robust base for what we lawyers are expected to do at work.

    Do you consider pursuing higher studies after graduation? How important is it for a lawyer to go for higher studies? Were you inclined at any time, towards the civil services?

    Not really till now. Although I feel certifications in specialized fields can add a lot of value to the entire candidature for future opportunities. Higher studies in my view, is helpful if you are looking for a career shift like teaching, MBA, etc. Higher studies can also buy you time in case you are inclined towards exams like civil services, judiciary etc.

    A civil services exam is a different ball game and students must start preparation while in law school as the time period of five years is a huge opportunity in itself. No doubt it is a brilliant career choice.

    Tell us something about lawyerouno.com.

    Lawyerouno is my love-child that I started three years back, just to give something back to the community. It is a platform which connects people looking for lawyers to lawyers for free. We have lawyers from over 60 cities on the portal. We started the venture with a social outlook and we are still trying to be true to it. The basic thought, behind the idea was to provide young lawyers who want to set up their practice, an opportunity to connect with clients. We are also planning a few products on the portal to provide competitive pricing advantage to the clients.

    How difficult was it for you to connect and convince different lawyers to register on lawyerouno.com?

    As the registration for lawyers on the portal was free and the intention was to provide them with an opportunity to connect with the clients, I actually did not face any resistance from them, although the technology for some senior lawyers was a challenge, which we circumvented by assisting them with a unique live chat support feature.

    What is the international financial situation owing to upcoming regulations and situations?

    My current role in TCS involves setting up of compliance support practice for financial sector clients. The financial world ever since the 2008 crisis is in a state of flux. The regulatory authorities are driving regulatory dynamism as an instrument of change. The more they want to be in control the tougher it is getting for the companies. The Brexit will spur a marked shift for financial companies trading or headquartered in the UK. The companies are vying for the regulatory advantage and gearing up their compliance departments for various new regulations like Mifid II, EMIR, Basel 3 etc. More the regulations better it is for us! All in all it is looking good for the lawyers in the compliance sphere.

    Would you say that the work environment at an LPO is completely different from a law firm?

    Although my current profile is consulting, my initial experience with Thomson Reuters in the LPO sphere convinced me that whatever notion we as law students have about LPOs is completely unfounded. In fact if you are looking for a career in corporate as opposed to litigation, LPO is a very good option as it provides you with the right learning opportunities, international exposure and a good work life balance. Several of my colleagues are now well-placed in the field of contracts and forensics with various fortune 500 companies and start-ups. Right after my stint with TR in the Compliance department, I was involved with a start-up Mind Merchants for setting up their global compliance practice, which started with 3 people and is now already 45+, hence my experience within LPO spurred my growth as a legal professional. The stark difference between the work cultures that I see between these industries is the autonomy and independence that any year 1-3 associate gets at an early stage in their career.

    What were your objectives and plans in the preliminary years of the law school?

    As any other student in the initial years the motive was to have fun and explore the college life to the Tee. It is the only in the penultimate and the final year, that I decided to chalk out a plan for myself. The plan was to identify what I enjoyed more, hence most of my firm internships were in those years which made me sure that I did not see it as my life choice.

    Lastly, what message would you leave for our budding lawyers?

    I urge students to explore themselves as much as possible instead of following treaded path blindly and choose what is best for them as a life choice rather than a career choice. Try not to be bound by what you hear, but channelize your choices around what you experience. Five years of law school is an opportunity, so use it well. All the best!

  • Biplab Lenin, Consultant, Cyril Amarchand Mangaldas, on building up expertise in Intellectual Property Rights

    Biplab Lenin, Consultant, Cyril Amarchand Mangaldas, on building up expertise in Intellectual Property Rights

    Biplab Lenin graduated from Rajiv Gandhi School of Intellectual property law (2009-2012). He is a qualified attorney with more than 4 years of both law firm and in-house experience in dealing with general corporate and intellectual property matters. He is registered to practice before Indian patent office and currently working with Cyril Amarchand Mangaldas at its Delhi office. His core areas of work include wide range of transactions, general advisory and intellectual property matters. He has acted on some of the significant and complex transactions that the intellectual property team has been involved with.

    In this interview he talks to us about:

    • How he build up expertise in IPR.
    • Primary essentials of a corporate lawyer.
    • Professional ethics one should follow while at work.
    • Basic subjects one should understand before sitting for an interview.

    How would you introduce yourself, given that most of our readers are law students, law aspirants or professionals in the legal arena?

    I am currently working as a Consultant with Cyril Amarchand Mangaldas in New Delhi. My practice areas include intellectual property laws and corporate laws. I am a registered patent agent at Indian patent office. I completed my LL.B. from Rajiv Gandhi School of Intellectual Property Law (RGSOIPL) in IIT Kharagpur Campus and also hold a graduate degree in Biotechnology Engineering.

    Were you always as fascinated by the field of IP Law or was it an acquired passion that set in through your college years?

    Since my father is also a lawyer, I was never a stranger to legal discussions which my father often used to do with his friends over evening tea after a long day in Court. Nevertheless, after 12th standard I followed the crowd of students doing engineering. In the last semester of my engineering, there was a subject called ” Intellectual property Rights”. Somehow, it attracted me quite a lot mainly because it involved both technology and law. That led me to apply for the course at RGSOIPL at IIT Kharagpur. I guess I was lucky to have studied under tutelage of good teachers and in a diverse peer group that IIT offers. Though I had an inclination towards IP subjects, at the same time, I wanted to do my internships on other subjects as well. Hence, I did internships with law firms as well as corporate in the domain of general corporate law, taxation, disputes, technology transfer and intellectual property law.

    How did you build up your expertise in IPR? Tell us about your work experience.

    My first hands on training on practical aspects of law happened in my internship at Monsanto. After finishing law school, I joined Mahyco as an in-house Counsel where I worked on different IP laws like patents, trademarks, plant variety, biological diversity and technology transfer. More importantly, interactions with several eminent scientists and stalwarts in the agri-biotech domain helped me realize the importance of understanding the technical nuances of the technology involved in any IP law. My engineering education helped me a lot in this area.

    After completing three and half  years of satisfying work at Mahyco, I joined Cyril Amarchand Mangaldas at Delhi where I am working on matters related to patents, plant variety, biodiversity, transfer & assignment of Intellectual property and general corporate transactions. On litigation front, I am a part of the team which is handling patent infringement and drugs ban litigation before the Delhi high Court. 

    Tell us about your schooling and early life. What do you think are the habits that you cultivated which help you today?

    I did my schooling from Sainik School in Bhubaneswar from Class 6th till Class 12. I think the values of integrity, camaraderie which are a hallmark of the army, are ingrained in me now. Also, Sainik School gave us a lot of endurance training, which helps me when I have to work for long hours in the Firm! I feel that my school experience was also quite instrumental in putting me at ease in any group with diverse cultural backgrounds, which is helpful for an attorney whose work involves people interaction.

    How are internships helpful for a law student? What are the other options available for someone interested in IP?

    Internships have a role to play in one’s professional career as a lawyer. They help us in learning how the law is practically applied. Also, business aspects of transactions are also better appreciated in internship. Skills like corporate communication are sharpened during internship. For those who are interested in making a career in IP, I suggest doing first internship under a practicing lawyer to get a feel of our justice delivery system. It is also important to look for quality work rather than brand name. There is no point in securing an internship in a big organization where there is little work for an intern. Students can join an IP specialized law firm or corporate for doing internships.

    Having Said that, I also feel that one should not be obsessed with stuffing one’s CV with internships. It is important to remember that in college one is a “professional student”and one’s primary duty as a professional student is to study the law books and the basic concepts. What can be learnt in 10 internships over 5 years in a no-pressure situation can be learnt in 6 months in a pressure situation when one starts actually working after college. Many times these days, interns, who have finished more than 10-12 internships in their first 3-4 years of college, but unclear about fundamental legal concepts, which I believe is injustice to one’s profession as a student.

    How do you maintain your work-life balance?

    I have always had a problem with this concept which pre-supposes that work and life are different and need to be balanced. I believe the first step in achieving work-life balance is to love yourself and love your work. Luckily I do both! Presently my focus is on honing my skills. I believe I’m being paid to learn now so I’m not complaining at all! I also believe that even at a senior level people do get time for themselves while managing work and I feel this should not be a concern for us at least at the beginning of our career.

    Any extra-curricular or co-curricular activities did you take up during your time at RGSOIPL and engineering? How did the same affect your learning experience and prepare you for the legal sector?

    I participated in a few moot court competitions during my college. However, I enjoyed parliamentary debate competitions more and also participated in several case study competitions conducted at IIT Kharagpur. During my engineering days as well, I have participated in several paper and poster presentations.

    However, apart from legal skills, I used extra-curricular activities to build my communication skills and inter-personal skills. I was one of the founding members of moot court society and conducted the first parliamentary debate competition at RGSOIPL.

    During my law school days, I worked as a volunteer in an NGO named “Independent Thought” based in Delhi. The NGO works for the Eradication of Social Disparity and Injustice by promotion of Fundamental and Socioeconomic Rights. I used to assist team in doing research and preparing reports with regard to remedies on issues relating to child labour. This experience showed me the humane side of the law and it still keeps my sensitivity intact and reminds me that beyond all the paper work and legal arguments there are real people who are affected by what I do.

    Generally the first year after graduation is the most defining time of a fresh law graduate. What would you suggest a fresh law graduate should do to hold spirit and utilize the opportunities available?

    I would suggest a two-pronged approach:

    1. Many students are thinking about doing an LL.M, immediately after LLB. I feel that an LL.M. without any work experience is just an LLB with some more semesters and a thesis.
      I strongly encourage fresh graduates to take up some professional assignment of their liking instead of academics, be it with a law firm or corporate or even NGO. You’re bound to be confused, so make sure someone’s paying you in the meantime!
    2. In college, we first pay fees and then we learn. In a job, we get paid to learn. Therefore, as a paid student, learn as much as you can about different areas of law and practice. It is important to remember that most books mention “law” and “practice” separately, for example Banking Law and Practice, meaning thereby that practice is something different from mere legal provisions. This will help you in choosing a particular field or subject for your career.

    What are the primary essentials of a corporate lawyer? How do you say a fresh graduate can work on building these skills?

    I think honesty towards the client and one’s colleagues is of utmost importance. One may be low on information about a legal concept, which can be gained, but honesty must come from inside. This of course is a basic human requirement in any profession, so all law graduates must also try to imbibe these values.

    Patience is also a vital asset. One must not get affected by looking at how others are doing in the profession.

    What are the primary professional ethics you follow while at work? How do you deal with mistakes or errors?

    I believe that honesty is the best policy. If there is a mistake, one should admit immediately. Mistakes are bound to happen especially in areas where human effort is involved. In face of mistakes, first requirement is to maintain a cool head, accept a mistake has been made and then immediately start working on a solution. When I’m the team lead, I own the mistakes of my team. I think clients too appreciate such candidness.

    What are the basic subjects which one should read and have understanding of before sitting for an interview?

    From point of view of legal concepts, basic understanding of the following 5 subjects is a must for any civil lawyer regardless of any interview:-
    1. Contracts (including sale of goods and specific relief)
    2. Transfer of property
    3. Evidence
    4. Registration and stamp duty (basic concepts not details)
    5. Constitution (basic concepts)

    Thereafter, one may try to gauge the requirements of any specific interview and prepare accordingly.

    Where do you see yourself ten years down the line?

    Hopefully still on the line!! Jokes apart, my first aim is to build my expertise in my domain, which is more of an internal process. I haven’t really given a thought to any particular designation as such. But I would like to be a lawyer who has earned atleast two things – complete trust of  clients which  allows them to sleep peacefully as far as their legal worries are concerned; and respect from seniors and peers in the profession regarding my professional ethics and competence. Apart from this, designations are trivia!

    Please compare RGSOIPL with other law schools.

    RGSOIPL is a unique law school because admission itself requires a degree in technology or medicine. Being a part of IIT Kharagpur campus, it has an IIT-style admission process with entrance test, group discussion and interviews, which is a great learning in itself. It attracts students from all over the country, which helps in enriching one’s culture and view of life. Also, studying law in the IIT Kharagpur campus in the midst of the crème-de-la-crème of India’s technical brains, gave me 2 important lessons –

    • Law is an instrument to facilitate business and technology;
    • Law cannot be learnt or applied in isolation without an eagerness to learn the technical dynamics of any business.

    RGSOIPL also benefits from the infrastructure of IIT. We had access to major online legal resources like Westlaw, Manupatra and Hein online apart from books.  There are various co-curricular activities which one can pursue to unwind from demanding course schedule.

    How is your experience in working as In house and then shifting to law firm?

    Being an In-house counsel helps to learn the significance of law as a toll for business. However, I would advise to have law firm and court experience at the initial stages of the career and learn court proceedings and allied matters and then shifting to in-house.

    Shifting from In-house to a law firm is tough from a work pressure point of view. Also, subject experts are readily available when you are working in-house, which may not be the case in a law firm full of mostly lawyers. Anyone who wishes to develop a very particular specialization should work in in-house IP department. Law firm gives you a more diversified work. Needless to say, law firm working hours are more strenuous. However, learning as well as growth is much speedier in a law firm.

    What would be your parting message to our readers?

    An excellent CGPA is always good. However, it is important to co-curricular and extracurricular activities as well. Read as much as you can. Take risks when it is required. It is not necessary that every risk you take will result in success. There will be failures too.

    It is important to not think too seriously about oneself and one’s so-called reputation etc. while taking professional decisions. I think the most vital part is that one should feel good both as a human being and a lawyer.

     

  • Rohan Mukherjee, Founder, Grayscale Legal, on environment law, entrepreneurship, and his internship experience

    Rohan Mukherjee, Founder, Grayscale Legal, on environment law, entrepreneurship, and his internship experience

     

    rohan-mukherjee1Rohan Mukherjee is a student of NLU Odisha, Cuttack, batch of 2015. In 2013 he started his own entrepreneurial venture, Grayscale Legal, a non-profit company to bridge the gap in demand and supply of good legal research. Grayscale Legal  is a Legal Assistance & Research Service Company aimed at getting law students recognized and placed on the basis of their mettle, rather than their grades. Due to Grayscale’s success he was also inducted as a fellow into Kairos Society – a worldwide association for entrepreneurs and innovators. Apart from being an entrepreneur, he has also received a pre-placement offer from India’s first Environment Law firm – Enviro Legal Defence Firm.

    In this interview he talks to us about:

    • Starting up with GrayScale Legal
    • Getting inducted into Kairos Society
    • His internship experience

    How did you gravitate towards law?

    Well, that could be a long answer for one question. See, I had given up on my science subjects in school because my interest didn’t lie there, and I saw no sense in pursuing something that I, with all my heart, didn’t see myself in. As a child, when you see your relatives around you who happen to be lawyers, enjoying a great lifestyle, it does create an illusion that life gets to be easy with a robe on. Well, of course, we learn otherwise later on, but the money and influence does play an attractive role to a teenager. Changing the world and fighting for ideals comes later.

     

    What were the different things that you did these five years at NLUO?

    Well, I do play drums and percussion, so that kept me engaged in my initial years, although I failed to set up band for the University. I write a lot, sometimes short opinionated satires, or dabble with my own black humor genre of poetry. My apprehension towards public speaking was removed when I was introduced to parliamentary debates, and those seven minutes of speaking time, still makes my adrenaline pumping. Apart from all this, I have been a part of some other ventures and organizations as well in various capacities, like being the Associate Director of Model Governance Foundation at one point. I started Grayscale Legal in my third year, which is a Legal Assistance & Research Service Company aimed at getting law students recognized and placed on the basis of their mettle, rather than their grades. I was recently inducted into the Kairos Society as well.

     

    rohan-mukherjee2Please tell us about your project Grayscale Legal.

    We are a Section 25 private limited that provides legal professionals and laymen with Legal Research and Assistance. Our basic aim is to assign students to professionals on various assignments on a monthly basis or a task wise basis in order to get their work recognized by the concerned client which in turn materializes into further opportunities and job offers.

     

    Where did you get the inspiration for this venture?

    It started as a survival instinct for myself. I knew that just my grades won’t get me ‘placed’ anywhere, but at the same time I also knew that I wasn’t a complete idiot. The only way to make a potential employer know you for your work, for the sheer ability to perform and deliver and to an extent ignore the fact that exams are not your best friend, was to take up assignments from them directly and work in exchange for recognition. Also, law offices do not have legal interns in their office all the time, and being a cloud based company, we get to fill in that gap virtually. Also, with students’ access to campus libraries, online legal databases etc., the research material is vicariously accessible to the clients as well.

     

    What factors do you think makes your project innovative and successful?

    We are far from successful at this juncture. But I would like to think of Grayscale Legal as a way to bridge the gap between campus and offices. Sure, there is nothing innovative about that, but our aim is not to simply dole out research assignments, our aim is to enable law students to generate their own pool of contacts – established professionals who recognize and recommend them for their professionalism. I should also vouch for the selfish interest factor, where a student is assigned to a client, it is up to him/her to undertake full responsibility for these projects and apart from the commission, the prospect of a  job offer, that you have managed to earn yourself is a kick in itself.

     

    Initial investment is a big issue for any start- up, how did you manage that?

    Being a cloud based company, and a non-profit one, I was able to bootstrap the initial expenditure from my father and uncle. I am fortunate that they saw some merit in this idea and were on board. Of course, our expenditure is limited to the website maintenance and incorporation costs.

     

    What challenges arise when you handle law school and entrepreneurship at the same time?

    I don’t really get worked up about on-campus matters, apart from the gnawing fact that I need to graduate next year at all cost. But for me, Grayscale Legal takes complete precedence over everything else. I mean, to be honest, I wouldn’t be where ever I am, giving this interview, I wouldn’t be attending client meetings and speaking to them on a level basis if not for this company. Every week starts off with a full blast of insecurity and every day is a pounding of anxieties when it comes to the future of the company, or daily assignments for that matter. I do tend to micromanage a lot, which was my strategy to prevent anything from getting messed up, but I am gradually training myself to let things go – or to delegate them to other people.

     

    Tell us a bit about Kairos society. What do you have to do being a part of it? How did you become a member?

    The Kairos Fellowship is designed to support individuals working on high-impact ventures. The newly inducted members are immediately entered into a community of likeminded changemakers, and they’re presented with opportunities to connect with industry leaders and influencers through Kairos events and Kairos partners. When their venture is ready for distribution, they’re encouraged to apply for this Kairos 50 venture program. You can also read a bit about it on Kairos Society

    The Kairos Society started with a vision: What if the leaders of today were friends 30 years ago, working together to solve our world’s grandest challenges? Becoming a Kairos fellow is a commitment to impact, and we hope to take full advantage of the opportunities presented to us throughout the year. More importantly, we hope to continue to support each other on the path to creating meaningful ventures, and build relationships that will last a lifetime.

    To become a member you have to be recommended by an existing fellow or apply on your own. The modalities are on their website. This is open for students working on their ventures that might have a global impact.

     

    How supportive are your parents and peers towards this project?

    Well, there is plenty of support from my parents. Rest, I haven’t really thought about. Doesn’t matter anyway. As long as you know what you’re doing, and doing it well and with complete dedication, charging after it like a rhino – Support and good wishes from third parties are just a bonus.

     

    Why are so many aspiring lawyers taking the entrepreneurial plunge?

    No campus placements? Kidding. In my view entrepreneurship and litigation walk hand in hand – the thrill and risk of starting your practice from scratch, making your services worth the client’s money, client retention, growth and expansion of business are all common areas. Of course, we are lucky to be living in this era where the internet apart from making us aware various prospects, has given birth to many ventures as well. Also people have starting to realize that a law degree is a like a passport to a multitude of fields, and is never necessarily bound in a chain. It is brilliant that many are turning to set up their own ventures that have changed the way the legal fraternity interacts with the legal ecosystem. There still has to be a burst in technological innovation in this field – we are still satisfied with an Android app of the Supreme Court listing, where as there are software programs used in other countries, by lawyers, which reduce the time taken for legal research by leaps and bounds. That level of tech-savviness still needs to come in India. Hopefully, our generation will take care of that.

     

    What specific areas of law education helped you in your venture?

    I would have to say Company Law since it is after all an incorporated entity. But frankly, no legal education really prepares you for this. Today I can rattle out the importance and use of DIN (Director Identification Number), the process of preparing and filing the MoA and AoA, the documents used, the property documents to be produced as proof for office space – and no paper prepared me for this, or it could have, but I didn’t pay attention. I mean, the idea that we could possibly register ourselves as a Section 25 company came to me after going through online articles, and then perusing through Section 25 of the Companies Act itself. Which is also interesting because strictly speaking, the provision chalks out organizations whose purposes are ‘educational’, ‘charitable’ or ‘religious’ – but it is followed by ‘or any other useful purpose’. I reckoned that our work is definitely ‘useful’ so I cast my line based purely on calculated guts.

     

    Do you intend to work for this project primarily after your graduation?

    After graduation my priorities will naturally change. I need to build myself as a legal professional first and foremost, and I realize that I will not be able to juggle both with equal dedication and in essence, fail to do justice to both of these arenas. I do intend to shift the management of the Company to another student, and of course, in our line of work it makes perfect sense for the person to be personally motivated to see the company grow and evolve and use it as means to your professional life, and that can only appeal to a student, someone who generally will possess that sense of urgency and insecurity. I will still remain a Director, but will restrict my involvement to the bare minimum.

     

    Did you get any institutional support for internships from your college?

    In my course of four years, I have interned with Sr. Adv. Uday U. Lalit, West Bengal Human Rights Commission, Enviro Legal Defence Firm (ELDF), Sinha & Co., AZB Delhi, AZB Mumbai and  followed by a string of ELDF internships.

    I would say all of them helped shape up my career choice in a great way. Sometimes, only after gaining some experience in a particular office can you be completely assured of your distaste for that work culture or professional life. I remember during my second year, when  was interning with ELDF for the first time, there was a day when the office was almost empty  and our Managing Partner, Sanjay Upadhyay simply asked me to speak to a client who would be coming in a while since he had to leave as well. I mean, it might not seem a big deal, but as a second year student, to be able to interact with a client with no one overseeing your interaction at that point was itself a kick. My subsequent internships with ELDF have been amazing as well – I have also been to our North Eastern office in Guwahati a few months back, and to be involved to this extent at this level, is something very few mentors can successfully do. Of course, you are constantly humbled by the fact when it comes to any field of law, let’s say laws concerning the environment in this case, there is so much to know – and the in-depth knowledge that is required for a person to confidently say, that yeah, I know this subject, takes a lifetime. Or perhaps, more!

     

    How did you apply to Enviro Legal Defence Firm?

    For an internship, you are required to mail the Internship In-Charge Ms. Suparna Jain at suparna@eldfindia.com and that is usually followed by a submission of your CV and a short essay encircling your statement of purpose etc. A student can intern for four weeks or more and if I remember correctly, during my second year, they did say that they take in students from their third year onwards, but I managed to get an exception since we had covered, on paper, Environmental Law as a subject in our second year.

     

    Tell us a bit about the firm, your typical workday and the overall work/life balance.

    ELDF is an independent team of erudite legal professionals, which provides services to anyone who approaches us, including Governments, Non-Government Organizations, Educational Institutions, Individuals, Private and External Agencies engaged in areas of environment and development law. We have been a part of numerous international forums and have helped in policy building in many nations. Our firm is divided into two teams – Consultancy and Litigation. There are various regional offices present in cities like Pune, Guwahati, Ernakulam and Ranchi.

    My typical work day is like any other associate at the firm. Since, I work with the litigation team, if a matter I am involved in is listed in the NGT or Supreme Court, I have to be  there for the hearing. If not, the work on the cases/projects assigned which ranges from research, drafting, client meetings, further information gathering and strategy building takes up time. The question of work/life balance is a difficult one, of course.

    I am one of those who believe that if you are passionate about your work, it is difficult to switch your ‘professional life’ off after 9 PM or maintain some form of clock for the same. I won’t say that there is an extreme pressure, but it certainly depends on an individual’s priorities. Even as an intern you are credited at par with associates, and made answerable for any screw-ups as well. Office hours would be from 10 AM to 6 PM, but as in any law office, you are expected to put in extra hours if the work demands so.

     

    What do you think interns should accomplish in the course of their internship to get a callback?

    (Rohan has secured a PPO with ELDF.)

    You have to market your strengths in any work environment. And it’s not like you have to prowl around for any work offer that may come your way, if you are genuinely interested in a particular field and feel that a particular law office shall provide you with the perfect exposure in the same, go for it.

    After a few conversations with Sanjay Sir, I had made some form of positive impression on him. Hes has also been a guide when I was setting up Grayscale Legal and was instrumental in providing his feedback on the same. It is very difficult to pin-point exactly ‘how it happened’ because it happened very naturally which is how it should be. And naturally, my work with Grayscale Legal certainly played a role in backing this up as well.

     

    Was there any interview process?

    There wasn’t any formal interview as such for this. There might be one after graduation though.

     

    Where do you see yourself five years from now?

    The initial 5 years will be difficult, and frankly, I look forward to the nudging and pushing required now. Five years is also a make-it-or-break-it period for myself; the time required to be well versed with the laws and procedures; to have substantial visibility in courts and do my work well. For me, nothing takes priority over a client’s interest – one might get into long ethical debates on the same, but let’s save that for later. For a start, apart from my legal career, I’d love to open up a quaint, warm pub, I’d like to pursue my music as well – so five years down the line, I hope I am happy with where ever I am. Or perhaps not. Being dissatisfied has worked out well for me so far.

     

    What would be your message to law students who want to start-up?

    Go for it. Trust me, you will not get a better time to fall, fail and learn again.

     

  • Sandipan De, NALSAR, on commercial law, his diverse internship experience, and bagging a Training Contract with Allen & Overy

    Sandipan De, NALSAR, on commercial law, his diverse internship experience, and bagging a Training Contract with Allen & Overy

    Sandipan De is a student of NALSAR, Hyderabad, batch of 2015.  He has earned three gold medals through his years of B.A. LL.B. He has secured internships with the likes of PwC, Khaitan & Co., CNBC TV 18, Argus Partners (formerly Udwadia Udeshi & Argus Partners), Talwar Thakore & Associates (Indian 'best friend' firm of Linklaters LLP)Talwar Thakore & Associates, and AZB & Partners. He also received  the opportunity of signing a Training Contract with Allen & Overy, London. In this interview he talks about:

    • Taking up varied internships and developing specific interest
    • Securing a contract with Allen & Overy
    • A typical workday at a Magic Circle law firm

     

    Why did you decide to study Law? What inspired you to do so?

    I was interested in commerce and business from a very early age. I remember I used to read the Economist, BusinessWeek and preferred the Economic Times over a normal daily. I think that built up my interest in the commercial world. The choice was between doing something finance related or commercial law. I had a flair for the language and logical reasoning. I thought law would best marry both my interests. Thus, law school happened.

     

    What do you have to say about mooting at law school and legal writing for journals?

    I have done only one moot- Vis. I think I might not be best suited to air my views about mooting but I genuinely feel that mooting as an activity is over hyped in Indian law schools. During my exchange semester at Santa Clara I figured that Indian law schools seem to privilege mooting over other activities but the sort of help, coaching and resources in foreign law schools is unmatched here in India. You should definitely try your hand at mooting but it isn’t the be all and end all of law school. The experience and learning is great but it isn’t something you can’t do without. I think legal writing and editorial positions are possibly very important. The sort of skills you develop there are extremely relevant and the reason why I tried my hand more at legal writing was because it let me delve into any area I wanted- topics that interest me as opposed to the confines of a set problem.

     

    Tell us about your internship in the chamber of Senior Advocate, Saha & Ray Associates & IMS Learning Resources.

    Well a bit of both to be honest. I wanted to try out the experience of litigation and see how a small law firm worked. I liked the experience and helped me decide that I did not see myself in litigation. Transactional practice was what I wanted. I have been teaching at IMS since my second year of law school. I really like this, as it keeps me in touch with the law aspirants and I enjoy teaching really bright students and try to advise them in making informed decisions.

     

    Coal India Limited & CNBC TV 18 are unconventional internship choices. What went behind making those decisions?

    I have to admit that by this time I was sure that I wanted to be in commercial law and had a sort of idea of what I wanted to do. I planned to see commercial law in action from every different facet possible. Commercial litigation, a behemoth PSU, etc. I interned with the only show that dealt with corporate law in India, while at CNBC, and that possibly was one of the best experiences during internships because of its unconventional nature.

     

    What kind of exposure did you gain with PwC?

    I worked with the in-house counsel’s team which was in the risk management vertical. Working with a Big Four was a different cultural experience and the risk management team was a whole new experience- it was about one client and trying to ensure best practices and the best risk management policies. I am not at liberty to divulge the sort of work I did but it was really interesting, tested your mettle and understanding of the business and involved coming up with best practice policies to guard against present and future liabilities.

     

    What is a typical day like working at law firms?

    AZB is still freshly etched in my memory. It was brilliant work. The work hours were exceptionally long but I enjoyed the thrill of working on India’s biggest transactions. It involved everything from simple research work to even trying your hand at drafting documents. I have to accept that the work I got from seniors was top-notch, they relied on you, gave you responsibility, expected you to put in the long hours but appreciated you for it. UU Argus was a relatively smaller environment and I really enjoyed the personal touch and the individual attention I got. Possibly, this is where I had completely made up my mind on transactional practice.

     

    You were selected in the Winter Vacation Scheme of Allen & Overy. Our readers are very keen to know how the entire application process works and what they look for in a student when making selections?

    After you get selected for the vacation scheme A&O is the only firm which gives Indian students the option of going for a winter scheme as opposed to the conventional summer scheme. The Magic Circle and Silver Circle firms come down to a select few law schools in India and interview the candidates for their vacation schemes (which are akin to an internship) after having shortlisted students on the basis of the application form which is released in July of fourth year through the RCC.  Some law firms have more rounds after the application form including but not limited to critical reasoning and verbal reasoning tests. The interviews are usually sometime in September.

     

    How was your experience in the UK working at Allen & Overy? How did you manage the finances and accommodation?

    Finances and accommodation including travel are paid for by the firm. On top of that the firm pays you a weekly stipend. London is not just a great city but a financial, cultural and political capital. It is a thrilling experience to be working in the City of London (which is the financial district) and enjoying the thriving cultural life that London offers which is truly unparalleled. You are working in the world’s greatest financial centre on the biggest and best of deals- transactions that are FT headlines. A&O is a great place- possibly the friendliest of the Magic Circle firms, offers great quality work, exposure and training. Possibly, that is true for all of the MC firms but what really sets A&O apart is that they treat you as an individual, really care about you as a person, your career, future and training and the work atmosphere is collegiate. I never felt like ‘just an intern’. It was the best experience I had had and I was sure that if I was offered the TC A&O and London is where I wanted to be.

     

    Tell us about your typical working day and the sort of work you were expected to do? How were your fellow co-interns?

    I am presuming that you are asking about the A&O work during the vacation scheme. A standard day involved a commute on the famous London tube to work and reach ingoffice by 8:30 a.m. Put in half an hour of personal work (glancing through the FT, reading up on the topic for the client pitch exercise, mailing a couple of people to benefit from their expertise on a particular area, etc.). I would then carry out the tasks delegated to me by my Trainer, possibly meet my fellow vac schemers for coffee at eleven on the rooftop restaurant which gives you possibly one of the best views of the City and catch up on where we are with our client pitch exercise. Go back to my desk and continue with my allocated tasks. Usually there would be a networking lunch with different people drawn from diverse practices of the firm to know more about the practice areas and the firm in general. We would typically have a couple of talks scheduled by the HR, Partners, etc. during the afternoon which we would need to attend. Following that there would be that surprise drinks counter at the inhouse bar called Lavanda where you would grab a couple of drinks with your fellow vac schemers and catch up on the latest, know more about each other’s work in different departments and then head off to your accommodation unless you had a dinner or social event to attend. The dinners are usually at top-end restaurants and the social event would be really exciting stuff like ice skating at the Tower of London where you would be accompanied by your Trainer buddy and other young trainees at the firm with whom you can informally interact and they would give you informal advice and buy you a couple of drinks after a hard days’ work. You then get back to your accommodation and prepare for your interview or research for your group exercises and then try to catch some sleep to prepare for another exciting day ahead.

     

    You are joining Allen & Overy after graduation. How did this work out? What would be your advice to those law students who want to secure such a contract?

    After the vacation scheme you fill up a form for the Training Contract application and appear for an interview with a Recruitment Partner on your last day. Once you get back to India the HR will let you know the outcome within a week’s time. Be yourself. There is no one sort of personality that they are looking for. Technical competence is a given. The HR can look through if you are feigning interest and thus I would suggest that you venture down this road if you are really interested in commercial law and you know that this is your calling. Try your hand at everything in law school but keep yourself focussed. Be commercially aware. Very very aware. Do you apps very well so that your real personality is communicated through it. At the interview stage do not try to be a person you are not. I remember that a few people mentioned two so-called ‘tests’ that you need to pass- one is the client test and the other is ‘can we work with you test’. The latter is self explanatory and the former essentially points to whether the firm can put you in front of a client and can you hold your own. The other difference I have to highlight is that the foreign firms value a more holistic approach rather than just technical knowledge. As I said, technical competence is a given, client context and permeating a legal solution through a commercially viable idea is what is expected.

     

    Any tips for an intern who wants to get noticed at work by dint of her performance?

    Again, be yourself. Don’t try to be someone you are not. Work hard and network with people. Talk to people. Never be afraid to walk through someone’s door and ask for work. The worst that can happen is that person telling you that there is no work at present to delegate and you should ask someone else. Lawyers are a very intelligent crowd. Be a person whom people can work with. I would say know your politics, current affairs, music, etc. At the end of the day you need to be a person with whom everyone enjoys working with. You can spew all the jargon you want but hitting up a conversation with a person on a topic he is keenly interested in would cast a far deeper impression than knowing a particular SEBI regulation. Of course that too is important. (Remember the ‘can we work with you test’)

     

    How well do you think your education at law school prepared you for real world practice? What do you feel about 5th year in the B.A. LL.B course at NLUs? Is it sufficiently utilized or needs a huge revamp?

    I think the new academic model at NALSAR and the practical and industry oriented courses have really gone a long way in helping us prepare for the real world of practice. I have to thank the seniors and the informal mechanisms at NALSAR which are a sine qua non. I think all that forms a part of the legal education package. I like the idea of fifth year. Lot of partying to look forward to. I can’t speak for all NLU’s but the new model at NALSAR with single credit optionals on such varied subjects along with interesting opportunities like Teaching Assistantships are really exciting and I look forward to the last year of law school. I am TA-ing for Contracts and can’t wait to get back to college.

     

    You were part of the RCC at your college. What prompted you to volunteer for it?

    I am part of the RCC which is a peer-elected body as the placement process at NALSAR is completely student run. I wanted to run for the RCC because securing your job is important but if you can play a small part in facilitating your batchmates’ jobs- people whom you have literally lived with for the four years in law school- there is no satisfaction like that. The work involves negotiations with organisations, facilitating on-campus interviews, working in a team and trying to secure jobs for all. Involves drafting documents, making pitches, interacting with industry honchos, strategising and not so glorious tasks like running around getting tea, arranging desks and chairs, moving beds to arrange for interviews, etc. The experience is definitely worth it. I work with a great team of people in the RCC. I think the excellent Day Zero figures from NALSAR are a testament to that. I am proud to have a batch where everyone is behind the RCC and don’t just retire into their rooms and let the RCC do all the work. Plus, we have an extremely proactive and excellent administration who always have your back. My sincere hope is to see all my classmates placed as soon as possible.

     

    Does being from one of the top three NLUs really come with additional perks?

    Well, this might be controversial but I do believe that the top NLUs do have it better for their students. I think it is about getting an edge over others. However, it is not something that one can’t make up.

     

    How important are grades in securing a job?

    It is definitely important. It does get your foot in through the door but CGPA isn’t the only thing. At the end of the day once you are inside that interview room or in that internship it is your competence that matters and not just your gradesheet.

     

    Any advice you would like to give to law students aspiring for a job at top law firms?

    Go for it only if you really like commercial law. Try to understand the business and commercial angle to things. That makes it really interesting. Try to learn as much as you can. Contrary to the popular gyan on the topic no task is unimportant- even if you are doing a proofread you are getting the chance to see a document which you would have otherwise never seen. I would say put your mind to it try to understand the transaction, the clauses, ask questions. No one will mind if you are interested and ask questions about the work that they are doing. I think you should rather prepare from your first two years. Try to figure out early in the day where your interests lie. Whether it be commercial law, policy work, social justice or opening a restaurant- figure out early and work towards it from the beginning.

     

    Lastly, what would be your message to our readers?

    I had a great time at NALSAR over the past four years and made friends for a lifetime, had seniors that I would look up to forever, some of the greatest professors to whom I would be indebted to forever. Don’t lose yourself over CGPA and the proverbial ‘CV building’. Surely that is important but do enjoy law school. It is a unique experience. Very few careers in India offer you the sort of opportunities that law school does. Pay homage to the Old Monk, be intensely loyal to your university, make great friends, and have the time of your life.

  • Smrithi Mariam on steps to getting good internships and a PPO

    Smrithi Mariam on steps to getting good internships and a PPO

    Smrithi Mariam a student of  the 2014 batch at RMLNLU  has secured a Pre Placement Offer from Lexygen. We asked her to share her experiences and strategies she used over the years. In this interview she speaks about:

    • Mooting and its benefits for a law student
    • Preparing a C.V. and interviews
    • Getting good internships and a pre-placement offer

     

    Why did you decide to study Law? What inspired you to do so?

    It took me a while to figure out what exactly I wanted to do after the 12th and being a science student I wrote all the possible engineering entrance exams. At the back of my head I knew that this wasn’t my thing and I began coaching for the CLAT. That’s when I realized that I could see myself as a lawyer and that most of all studying law would make me happy.

     

    Do you have any lawyers in your family? Do you think having family members with a legal background help in this profession?

    I’m a first generation lawyer, but I do have a lot of friends who have lawyers in their families and yes, I do think that it helps to have a family member in the profession to guide you in the  and show you the how things work. But, on the other hand NOT having such a person means that you need to stand up for yourself, take charge, be resourceful and figure out the ropes on your own.

     

    What are the extracurricular activities you took part at RML NLU?

    Sport has always been an important part of my life and I’ve been a member of the college basketball team throughout my law school life. I have also taken part in Parliamentary Debates, I enjoying ‘JAM’ing, traditional debating and other literary events.

     

    You have taken part in a lot of Moot Court Competitions in college, can you share a few mooting experiences?

    My first national moot was the Nani Palkhivala National Tax Law Moot, I was in my third year and we finished runners up at the competition. This moot holds a very special place in my heart and I vividly remember the finals, where we argued in front of Bombay HC Judges on a matter that was actually pending at the ITAT. The finalists at this moot are awarded internships a top tier tax law firms in the country which is a bonus. I also took part in the Stetson International Environmental Law Moot and our team finished semifinalists at the world rounds and we secured speaker and memorial citations. Arguing against law students from schools in Poland, USA, Ireland, etc was enriching and being able to connect with them and exchange stories from our home towns was an unforgettable experience. In my final year I took part in the North India rounds of the Phillip C Jessup International Moot and was part of the team placed third. That was a bitter sweet end to our mooting life, so close yet so far!

     

    Do you think mooting is beneficial for Law students or is it just to make your CV look fancy?

    I love mooting and everything that comes with it. The crazy workload, the compulsory reading, the brain storming sessions, the sudden burst of energy when someone comes up with an argument, the list goes on. In my opinion, mooting helps you learn how to work in a team, how to keep your head together and work on a single matter for months together, how to logically work your way out of situations and come up with novel arguments and most importantly it allows you the freedom to learn and explore a new subject at your own pace without a project or an exam deadline breathing down your neck. Yes, mooting may make your CV look good but that’s not why you should take it up.

     

    What are the law firms at which you interned? Which internships will you consider to be right at the top and why?

    I have interned at JSA, AZB, AMSS, ELP, Trilegal, Samvad Partners and Lexygen. I enjoyed all my internships, but my stints at Samvad, Lexygen and ELP would be the ones I consider most enjoyable. The work environment, quality of work and most importantly the unbiased nature towards students from ‘lower rung’ law schools in these places really impressed me.

     

    What was the procedure you followed to apply to these law firms?

    Continuous emails to the HR of the firms and then follow up phone calls. It’s easier said than done and one has to listen to a number of rejections but it is possible. My college RCC also helped out with one internship.

     

    What was the kind of work was allotted to you during your internships?

    Work given to interns depends largely on the firm you are working with and their policy towards interns. Some firms trust interns with meaty assignments and allow them be a part of an ongoing client matter, while other firms hand out a lot of due diligence work. I have had my fair share of both types of work.

     

    You secured a job with ‘Lexygen’ as a ‘PPO’. How many times have you interned there before? How was the experience of that internship (if you did one) and how was it different from other internships?

    I have worked with Lexygen on two occasions for a total of 12 weeks. After short listing your CV they conduct a telephonic interview based on which they offer you the internship. The firm offers internships only to 4th and 5th year students strictly for the purpose of assessing whether they can be absorbed into the firm after they graduate. Lexygen is a great place to intern at; the firm ensures that interns are a part of weekly training sessions where the latest law or judgment on a particular subject is discussed. The intern has to make a presentation at the end of the internship period and there is continuous assessment of the work done; the intern receives feedback on the completion of every assignment.     

     

    What do you think an intern should accomplish during an internship in order to get a “call back”?

    Get people to notice your work! There are no two ways about it. Many people seem to think that it is the people you get work from that make the difference, be that as it may, it is important to note that even if you are given work from a junior associate and you manage to impress them and continue to do so, a recommendation may be in the pipeline. A ‘call back’ also depends on a little bit of luck- being in the right place at the right time, etc. For example, interning when there are a large group of interns considerably lowers your chances of getting noticed as the work load splits among all of you.

     

    Did you learn any skills while interning? What are these skills and how did you acquire them?

    One skill that most law students acquire while interning is time management. More often than not interns are given a strict deadline by which they need to submit their work and managing your time is very important.

     

    How do you think one should go about writing a CV when they are applying for a job?

    I don’t think I should be an authority on the format of a CV but from what I have picked up, while applying for internships one must ensure that you change your CV as per the type of firm you are applying to. For example if you are applying to a Tax law firm highlight the tax work you have done at your internships or a paper you published in tax law journal, etc. Besides that, be clear, precise and to the point in your CV.

     

    How did you go about preparing for your interview?

    I was fortunate enough to secure the PPO without an official interview as I had been thoroughly assessed at both my internships. But in general for an interview be it for a job or for an internship knowing all the work that you have mentioned in your CV is the most important thing.

     

    Do the law firms usually provide the candidates with an option to work with the teams of their choice while recruiting?

    I understand that most law firms ask the candidate their area of interest, but there is no guarantee that you will be put in the team of your choice. It normally depends on the need of the firm and the vacancies available in their teams.

     

    Many law students strongly believes that getting a job at one of the top 3 law firms is mostly about securing a high GPA. Would you agree?

    Having a high GPA is important, but it is not the be all and end all of securing a job at a tier 1 firm. I personally know of people who have been placed at these firms with just above average grades. Especially in the case of PPOs, it is the quality of the work that you do and that is more important than your GPA.

     

    What would be your advice to the law students aspiring to secure a job at top law firms? What do they need to do, how should they prepare in the last 3 years of law school?

    As someone who is fresh out of law school, I do not feel competent to answer this question, but I will do my best by telling you my personal experience. Being in a law school that is not considered a ‘top’ one and wishing to secure a job in a ‘top’ law firm is hard but it is possible and I have seen it happen. Ensuring that you intern at the right time and making a mark at your internships can do wonders to your morale as well as your chances of getting a job.

     

    Follow her on LinkedIn: Smrithi Mariam Punnoose

  • Aonkan Ghosh, student, GNLU, on bagging high profile internships, application procedures, and how to convert them into jobs

    Aonkan Ghosh, student, GNLU, on bagging high profile internships, application procedures, and how to convert them into jobs

    Aonkan Ghosh graduated in law from GNLU, batch of 2009. He has had a series of successful internships during his time an an undergraduate.

    In this interview we talk to him about:

    • Approaching the right firms for internship opportunities
    • Trying to get a versatile internship experience
    • Building contacts and converting internship opportunities into prospective jobs

     

    What have been some of your internships so far?

    Well, I have interned at JSA, Gurgaon, Luthra & Luthra, New Delhi, Kachwaha & partners, New Delhi and Wadia Ghandy, Bangalore.

     

    What is the procedure to apply to these law firms?

    In your junior years I would say, it’s more about luck and persistence but apart from that, I think you should apply to as many places as possible 4-6 months in advance, follow up in general by calling and sending them emails, so that they feel that you are really interested in interning with them and just hope to get an internship!

     

    What was the kind of work allotted to you during your internships?

    I have to say, these law firms have a lot of work and a bit of that chunk is allotted to interns. I have dealt with matters related to due diligence and private equity transactions. I was asked to make research notes and opinions on the aspects of company law. While interning in these top law firms, I even got exposed to indirect taxes and learnt a great deal about arbitration, especially at Kachwaha. I worked with the corporate team and the litigation team both, so I got a chance to experience both kinds of work. Through my internships I have developed a fondness for the subject!

     

    How has your internship experience been?

    The experience was really thrilling. I got to interact with a lot of people and I was lucky to learn a lot from the associates. In law school you read the law but while interning you get to apply it, so overall I got to learn more about law and its application from my internships.

    What is the kind of work environment that you experienced in law firms?

    The internships were an incredible experience. The partners and the associates were extremely hardworking. Interns are also given a lot of work which might not be interesting but at the same time you get to gather a lot of knowledge and I personally did not face much of a problem in working for long hours because a lot of us are used to pulling off all-nighters in law school.

     

    What are the things an intern should keep in mind to get a call back?

    Diligence at work is the most important thing. You can’t be afraid to take initiatives. As an intern you are allowed to make a few mistakes but at the same time you are expected not to repeat them. The conduct of an intern is expected to be highly professional because it is something which is strongly taken into consideration.

     

    What do you think is important to convert a good internship into a job?

    It usually takes more than an internship to secure a job at a particular law firm. For an intern it is extremely important to be patient and wait for the right time to come. Try getting exposed to as many practise areas as you can and not just one. Another important factor is that as an intern you have to be presentable. If you keep all these things in mind then I think you should keep your fingers crossed and hope for a job.

     

    Which was the best law firm internship you have experienced?

    Nothing in particular; as in I won’t single out any firm but I learnt a great deal from all my internships. The experience was very pleasing and I was amazed at the professional conduct of the law firms.

     

    What do law firms consider the most while hiring?

    The pre-requisites are usually display of good academic record, your ability to work hard, then… how well you can apply your mind to situations, your ability to grasp and your awareness of current legal issues.

     

    Do the law firms usually provide the candidates with an option to work with the teams of their choice while recruiting?

    Well… definitely they ask you about your preference but the final decision is with the firm. They hire as per their requirements. Usually the recruiters decide the department which they think would suit you the most, so that you can grow as a professional and succeed.

    There is this general notion about AMSS being a GPA oriented firm. What is your take on that?

    They do take your GPA into consideration like other law firms but apart from the GPA they take your resume into consideration as a whole. I personally think that this notion is misplaced because the interviews for the top law firms are very stringent and even your extra-curricular activities are taken into consideration!

    What would be your advice to the law students who aspire to secure a job at top law firms?

    I think that the aspirants should develop the habit of reading. It is very important to build a knowledge base because it helps a lot in the future and if it is done passionately, then you can push yourself to the limit. Hard work is something very important, whether it is an exam or an internship, so keeping these things in mind is essential to be best prepared for an opportunity.