Tag: LL.B

This interview has been published by Namrata Singh and The SuperLawyer Team

Welcome back to the SuperLawyers channel! As our journey as an educational platform continues to grow, we have the privilege of gaining insights from esteemed professionals in the legal fraternity. Today, we are fortunate to have with us Mr. Ajay Sharma, a highly respected figure with over 35 years of experience in corporate law and human resource complexities. He has served as the Chief Legal Advisor for several distinguished organizations and currently holds the position at CorpoTech Legal.

Sir, on behalf of the entire SuperLawyers team, we extend a very warm welcome to you. We are thrilled to have you with us today and are eager to learn from your vast experience. We look forward to sharing this knowledge with a broader audience.

Thank you, Akash, for having me here. I’m glad to share my experiences from the last three and a half decades. I prefer to say “three and a half decades” because saying “35 years” might make me seem older than I feel. So, feel free to ask any questions that you think will benefit the audience, especially the upcoming generation and young lawyers. I’m happy to contribute to that.

Thank you so much, sir. This would be slightly a nostalgic retreat for you because the first question is, even after having three and a half decades of experience in corporate law. If I may ask you, sir, why did you decide to pursue law?

So, I don’t have a full 35 years of corporate law experience. However, during my post-graduation, when I was pursuing my master’s in psychology, I developed an interest in understanding the legal side of things. After completing my master’s, I enrolled in law school and graduated from Delhi University Law Centre I in 1992.

The knowledge of law stayed with me. Once you study law, it’s not something you forget—it remains with you. When I entered the world of HR, this legal background gave me an edge compared to other HR professionals who only had an MBA in HR. I had degrees in psychology, a PGD in HR, and law.

I began exploring how I could apply my legal knowledge, particularly in labor and employment laws, which further fueled my interest. Throughout my career, I worked for both government and private organizations in India and abroad. The knowledge and inclination to learn the laws of the land were always there.

When I was in Europe, I handled HR for around 13-14 countries, each with its own legal framework. It was both interesting and relatively easy for me to adapt to the local systems, understand their laws, and provide corporate solutions.

I also gained considerable exposure to contract law, particularly while working with semiconductor companies. There was significant involvement in software licensing and patent work, as the semiconductor industry heavily focuses on patent writing. My role involved encouraging employees to document and write patents, helping them understand how their ideas could be patented, and assisting patent attorneys in advancing those ideas. If an idea wasn’t patentable, I guided them on how to innovate further to create patentable solutions.

Though I wasn’t a legal professional per se, I applied my legal acumen in my work. That journey has always been a part of me. As I reached a stage in my life where I wanted to formalize my legal expertise, I registered with the Bar Council of Delhi. Now, I’m a practicing advocate, working in the Delhi District Courts as well as the High Court.

Sir, my next question would be related to your trajectory and also something which is a very important question to someone who has a wealth of experience like you, who has seen the change, especially the technology driven changes, what do you think is the contemporary attitude of the lawyers or Indian lawyers towards this robust, disruptive technology change?

I think this issue isn’t limited to Indian lawyers; it’s a global phenomenon. I have connections worldwide, and I’ve spoken to lawyers in the US as well. Some lawyers are more tech-savvy than others.

The key point is that just because legal technology is available doesn’t mean a lawyer will automatically adopt it. We need to see the value it brings. In the last three to four years, as technological advancements have emerged—especially with the advent of generative AI—more solutions have become available. However, some are still rudimentary.

For example, basic case management is more about automation than high-tech solutions. It can improve productivity for law firms or individual lawyers, but each lawyer evaluates technology based on the value it offers.

We have a basic maxim in management called WIIFM—What’s In It For Me? Why should I adopt this technology? Does it genuinely help, or is it just another trend? Legal tech providers must ensure their solutions add real value rather than just being another tool.

The core question is whether the technology provides a solution or is just another piece of technology. Once lawyers understand its value, they will likely adopt it. Another factor is the career trajectory in law. Lawyers typically start young and spend three to four years establishing themselves. By the time they reach their late 30s or 40s, they are deeply involved in their work and may not have the time to learn new technology. So, the technology must present itself as a solution that fits seamlessly into their work.

I recall an incident in 1996 or 1997 when I was working with a company that wanted to introduce email. Many people questioned why we needed email when memos and peons worked just fine. We organized a three-day program to teach senior executives about email, but they still didn’t see the benefit. We had to show them that email could empower them to communicate directly without relying on their secretaries.

If I draw a parallel to the legal profession, much of the legal drafting is done by paralegals. But if a lawyer can use AI to draft documents, it could be a significant advantage. However, generative AI is still in its early stages. The results from platforms like Gemini, Perplexity, and Meta AI are not yet perfect. So, as a lawyer, I might think, “Why should I invest my energy in something that isn’t fully reliable?”

This is a process of evolution, and things will gradually improve. It’s not about Indian versus overseas lawyers; it’s about managing change. Several stakeholders play a role in this. First, legal tech professionals need to work closely with lawyers. You can’t develop a legal tech solution in isolation. Second, the Bar Council of India could get involved to assess what solutions are available and what needs to be developed. Third, lawyers themselves need to engage with younger lawyers.

I’ve wondered if law firms or senior lawyers could have roles like “legal analysts” who use legal tech tools and assist senior lawyers, helping them appreciate how these tools work.

Today, there’s a lot of hype around AI, but it’s not a magic solution. It only works well if you input the right data—garbage in, garbage out. In summary, this is a process of change. All stakeholders must support this change management, and gradually, the legal community will start adopting and adapting to these new systems.

You have mentioned some of the inputs that it’s not only a domestic problem, it’s a global problem. Taking this issue a bit forward, my next question would be, sir, since you have this entire diverse experience of working both with domestic as well as global international organizations, consultancies, and firms, how do you think is the international work culture different from the Indian setup?

“We need to consider this from two perspectives.

First, the lawyer as an individual entity, and second, law firms as a whole. In India, we are governed by the rules of the Bar Council of India, which serve as our guiding principles. These rules are different from those in the US or Europe.

For instance, in the US and Europe, law firms are often treated as profit centers or businesses, so everything operates accordingly. In India, however, law firms are typically centered around individual lawyers. This is evident from the firm names, such as ‘X and X Company’ or ‘X and Associates,’ where the person who founded the firm remains at the top.

When it comes to management practices, it’s important for those approaching retirement to think about how the next generation should take over. That’s a fundamental aspect of management.

Abroad, what is written is strictly followed. They are very precise in their approach. In contrast, we Indians are more flexible, often going the extra mile to help clients. There is an advantage to this Indian way of working; our flexibility and adaptability allow us to navigate the unique challenges of our legal system.

Law isn’t just mechanical; it involves a great deal of emotional intelligence, as we deal with people. Thus, we need to engage with clients on a personal level.

The ideal approach would be to adopt a system-driven method, as seen in the West, while also incorporating the Indian way of flexibility and going the extra mile. By merging these approaches, we can create an eclectic system that draws the best from both worlds. That’s my submission.”

Sir, tagging along with this one is when you have described this differentiation in mechanism of working or the difference in attitude, what do you think should be learned from the global work culture?

The court has mandated that there must be a minimum stipend paid to young lawyers, and I fully support this. The issue is that without adequate financial support, talented individuals may leave the legal profession for higher-paying jobs in other fields. They may start with law, but if they find better-paying opportunities elsewhere, they are likely to pursue them.

Therefore, it’s essential to have a minimum threshold for stipends, as is common outside India. Another crucial point is the adoption of technology to enhance productivity. I’m very pleased to see the implementation of e-Courts and the e-Filing system. The encouragement for people to use virtual conferencing is a significant change that has taken place over the last three to four years. Our Chief Justice of India strongly supports the transition to these new systems, and we are also moving towards Online Dispute Resolution (ODR).

Things are moving in the right direction, but there’s still more to be done. For example, why can’t we have a world-class arbitration center in India? Recently, the GIFT City in Ahmedabad started an international arbitration center. We should be developing such systems and processes in India, rather than relying on places like Singapore for arbitration.

A system-driven approach is crucial. We also need to consider the productivity and well-being of lawyers. Expecting them to work 12, 13, or 18 hours a day can lead to burnout, especially at a young age. We need to create a work-life balance. At a young age, many people are working extremely hard, so it’s important to consider how to create a healthy work-life balance. Law is a profession, not just a relentless pursuit of earning money.

Additionally, I believe the Bar Council is making efforts in this direction, and I recently saw a judgment from the Madras High Court that reflects this. While I’m not suggesting that we should completely mimic the Western or global approach, we can certainly adopt the best practices from around the world. By combining that with our own ingenuity and the passion we have for our clients, we can create a balanced and effective solution.

Since you have been involved with providing unique technology solutions, you have been involved with HR automation, and much of your legal advisory also rests on technology. And we have this digitalization push in India also going on for quite a time, especially since after COVID this thing has been increased.

Sir, we would like to know your views on how important do you think is this digital and technological upskilling in lawyers and what would be your advice or how would you manage this entire technology upskilling operation in your team, or maybe in your organizations. We would love to hear your insights, sir.

Learning is a lifelong journey—you can’t stop. Even at 59, I’m still attending classes regularly. When it comes to legal education, particularly through alternative channels, it’s quite affordable compared to traditional college programs. Some institutions offer courses that are far less expensive, making continuous learning more accessible.

I strongly encourage young lawyers, including my own team, to continually take refresher courses because law is an evolving field. The beauty of law is that it’s never stagnant; there’s always something new to learn.

Take, for example, the recent changes in criminal law—the three new acts that have come into force. If you go through the provisions, you’ll notice that electronic evidence plays a significant role now. Electronic evidence isn’t just about technology law; it’s a form of evidence that is now integral to criminal, civil, and even family court cases. It’s crucial for legal professionals to understand what electronic evidence is and how to secure it, including the cyber forensic aspects.

In the Bhartiya Saksha Adhiniyam, electronic evidence is treated as equivalent to other forms of evidence, but it requires a certificate that details the source and hash value of the evidence. Now, if a lawyer doesn’t understand what a hash value is, how can they effectively present their case in court? Adapting to new technology is essential, and I always encourage my team—and myself—to stay updated with what’s available online.

Today, there’s a wealth of information on the internet, but it’s important to approach it in a structured manner. For example, when learning about the new criminal laws, I focus on understanding both the legal changes and the technological aspects, like electronic evidence. This process of continuous learning is ongoing.

Looking ahead, two significant acts are on the horizon: the Digital India Act, which may replace the IT Act, and the AI Act. Everything is interconnected. For instance, with the AI Act, we need to consider whether AI will be treated as an entity or a support system. If AI manipulates a copyrighted document to create a new one, who bears the responsibility? Is it the AI tool, the owner of the AI platform, or the user? Understanding these complexities requires deep engagement.

So, my advice to everyone, including myself and my team, is to stay at the cutting edge. Dedicate at least three to four hours each week to learning new developments in the legal field.

I really liked the way you have presented that there is no plateauing in the learning curve in the legal fraternity, it’s always a rising and so is upskilling. There’s no end to it. And sir, your words are truly powerful. When you see that even after having so much experience, you still choose to learn.

And that itself is such a motivational dialogue for all youngsters like me and even everyone else in this fraternity. I would like to ask, sir, that with this immense importance of data in today’s world, as is often said, that data is the new oil what are your views on the data legislation framework with reference to India and the other jurisdictions which you might have worked upon?

Let me rephrase that—data is like fuel. It can energize a system, but it can also cause damage if mishandled. Data has both positive and negative aspects.

We first started working with data in the corporate world through GDPR and even earlier with SOX compliance. So, data privacy isn’t a new concept for us. Today, we’re seeing the introduction of new laws—GDPR has established itself in Europe, CCPA is in place in the US, and in India, the DPDP Act has been passed, although it’s not yet enacted. But it will be soon.

The challenge exists on both ends: for those who provide data and for those who collect and process it. For example, how many of us actually read through all the terms when we download an app on our phones? We tend to just accept them without a second thought. The same goes for cookies on websites—we often accept or reject them without fully understanding what we’re agreeing to.

This is why education on data privacy needs to start at the user level. People should be aware of what constitutes personal and sensitive data, to whom they’re giving it, and for what purpose. Do we know that we have the right to request our data to be erased later? Or if we receive unsolicited calls or messages, do we realize that our data might have been leaked?

So, the first step is educating users. The second is ensuring those who collect data are also held accountable. Once the new laws are in place, there will be a stronger emphasis on enforcement. However, even with GDPR, I’m not sure how many companies have faced prosecution for data breaches. Enforcement is crucial.

Data is undoubtedly a powerful tool. We’re constantly surrounded by it, even in our interactions right now—this is all data. Both users and the originators of data, like ourselves, need to be educated to understand the impact of data on individuals, systems, and the world at large

This was very insightful, sir. I am really excited to approach you that as a professional who has indulged in diverse roles from law to tech to HR automation, what is your success mantra?

I believe that being a lifelong learner is crucial. The moment you think you’ve learned everything and reached the pinnacle, it’s like you’ve ceased to grow—you’re done. The quest to learn should never end. Even on your last day, you should be thinking, ‘What else can I learn? Is there something I can grasp in the next 10 minutes?’

Secondly, as professionals, we must learn to balance work and life. I was once like any other young professional, constantly working long hours. This eventually took a toll on my health. Fortunately, I had the opportunity to live in Sweden for a few years, where I met a cultural mentor. He was a simple man with around 55 patents to his name, mostly related to 3GPP and telecom technologies.

One day, he asked me, ‘Why do people in India, or Indians in general, work so hard?’ I responded, ‘We don’t have the kind of social security system you have here in Sweden.’ He then pointed out something that stuck with me: ‘Look at the average lifespan in India—around 70 years. People work hard until 60 or 65, trying to secure their future. After that, they often fall ill, and soon after, they leave this world. Where’s the life in that?’

You’d be surprised to know, that in Sweden, there’s a mandatory summer leave for all employees because that’s when they get to see the sun most often. The rest of the year is mostly dark. They believe you need to spend time with yourself and your family. I’m not saying we should imitate them entirely, but there’s a valuable lesson here. As professionals, we often think that our profession or company is everything. But when you reach old age, it’s your body that remains with you, not your job or your clients. The pain you’ll feel will be yours alone, not shared by your organization or clients. So, work-life balance is critical. I’m still working on it myself, but it’s something we all need to practice.

Lastly, professional integrity is paramount. I’ve never compromised on it. If something is wrong, you must have the courage to call it out and not engage in it. The world isn’t going to change because you decide to bend the rules or circumvent something when no one’s watching. The first gatekeeper is your own conscience. Maintaining professional integrity is essential to being a good professional. At the end of the day, you should be able to sleep peacefully, knowing you haven’t done anything wrong.

So, to sum up, three key things will help anyone grow: continuous learning, work-life balance, and professional integrity. These are timeless pieces of wisdom that I’ve learned from others and strive to follow.

Sir, you’ve placed a strong emphasis on sustainability, which is something we are eager to learn more about, especially given your long and distinguished career across various sectors. How do you view sustainability, both in your work and on a personal level? What does sustainability mean to you?

Sustainability, to me, is about using fewer resources while still achieving your goals. It’s about maintaining what you want to accomplish with minimal impact. This can apply to environmental sustainability, where we focus on preserving our planet, or personal sustainability, where you manage your life with the resources you have.

We often discuss sustainability in the context of global issues, which is aligned with the United Nations’ Sustainable Development Goals (SDGs). These 17 goals remind us that our purpose extends beyond just sustaining ourselves; we are here to contribute to the world as well.

Self-sustainability is crucial, but we must also consider the broader implications. For example, if the global temperature rises by two degrees in the coming years, what challenges will we and the next generation face? In cities like Delhi, we’re already experiencing water crises, and these issues are becoming more widespread.

Resource conservation is key, whether it’s on a personal level, in our homes, offices, or the broader environment. I’m not advocating for a minimalist lifestyle, but it’s important to be mindful of our actions and their impact on the climate. We have a responsibility to the world we live in.

My basic advice is to understand the resources you are consuming and strive to sustain with those, ensuring that you’re contributing positively to the environment.

Thank you for your response, sir. It feels like we’re learning from a wealth of experience. I’m sure all of us are trying to absorb these words of wisdom from you.

Lastly, I’d like to ask, what advice would you give to young lawyers, first-generation lawyers, and anyone who is aspiring or has just begun their journey in the legal fraternity?

The first and foremost thing is to understand why you are entering the field of law. Are you here to earn money? Are you here to provide justice? Or are you one of those who wants to support and uphold the legal system? This purpose is crucial to define early on.

I’ve been in the professional world for the last 35 years, and I’ve seen people who become engineers but aren’t engineers at heart. Passing an exam doesn’t make you a true engineer, just like earning an MBBS degree doesn’t necessarily make you a true doctor. A doctor is defined by their inner drive to serve humanity, not just by their title. Similarly, in law, you must have a clear purpose for why you’re entering this field.

Secondly, I recognize that it can be difficult for young lawyers to find internships and opportunities. I believe the system should do more to support them. My advice isn’t just for young lawyers, but also for seasoned, established lawyers: give opportunities to young professionals. It’s vital because the best way to learn law is through practice, not just by reading books. That’s why we say we “practice” law. You need a real-world platform to apply what you’ve learned.

Third, the world is changing rapidly. If you find that law isn’t the right fit for you, don’t hesitate to explore other professions. Don’t stay in the field if you don’t have the logical mindset or the empathy needed to understand your client’s needs. Technology is also changing the practice of law, and if you can’t adapt to these changes, consider moving to a different profession.

Just because you’ve studied law doesn’t mean you’re obligated to remain in the field. Sundar Pichai, for example, did his B. Tech in Metallurgy, but he’s now the CEO of Google. Education should develop your mind, not just secure employment. If studying law has sharpened your logic and awareness, you can apply those skills in other fields. No one is stopping you from becoming a great manager or technocrat.

In summary, focus your thoughts on whether you truly have the inner drive to be a lawyer. Seek out practical experiences, and if you find that this isn’t the right profession for you, don’t hesitate to make a change. Don’t become someone who constantly complains about the system. Instead, find a solution and move in that direction.

Thank you so much, sir. Your final statement about avoiding negativity and always seeking opportunities is incredibly inspiring. I’m confident that this message will resonate with young minds and serve as a guiding principle to motivate themselves through both highs and lows.

Today’s experience has been truly remarkable. It’s not every day that we have the privilege of interacting with someone who has witnessed such significant technological and social changes, both in India and abroad. Your insights have been enlightening for me and the entire SuperLawyers team. On behalf of everyone here, I extend our deepest gratitude for taking the time to address these important issues. It has been a wonderful experience.

My pleasure. As a parting thought, I’d like to emphasize that years of experience alone don’t hold much value; what truly matters is the wisdom gained. I believe in learning from the younger generation, a concept often referred to as reverse mentoring. As Darwin suggested, evolution implies that younger generations are more intelligent. So, it’s often more beneficial to learn from younger people than to rely solely on repeated years of experience.

Thank you very much for the opportunity to speak with you. I wish the SuperLawyers team continued success. The way you’re bringing together experiences from people across different stages and fields is sure to benefit the entire legal community. Thank you.

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