Super Lawyer

Author: Team Research

  • Gitanjali Ghosh, Assistant Professor, NLU, Assam, on LLM at NLSIU, academics and teaching as a career

    Gitanjali Ghosh, Assistant Professor, NLU, Assam, on LLM at NLSIU, academics and teaching as a career

    Gitanjali Ghosh graduated from North Eastern Hill University (NEHU), Shillong (2013). In law school she has interned with NHRC and was adjudged as the best Mooter at Henry Dunant Moot Court Competition. In 2014, Gitanjali completed her LL.M from NLSIU, Bangalore and has joined NLU-Assam as faculty. Along with teaching, Gitanjali is pursuing her Ph.D from NLSIU.

    In this interview she talks about:

    • Law school experience at NEHU.
    • LL.M from NLSIU, Bangalore.
    • Internships, mooting and her dream to opt teaching as a career.

     

    How would you introduce yourself? Tell us a bit about your pre-college years. What motivated you to study law?

    I hail from a town called Mangaldoi in the state of Assam. I finished my schooling from Don Bosco High School in my two and +2 from Cotton College in Guwahati. I went on to pursue B.A. LL.B. (Hons) from NEHU, Shillong and LL.M. from NLSIU, Bengaluru. Currently, I am also registered as a Ph.D. Scholar at NLSIU. Professionally speaking, I would like to introduce myself as an Assistant Professor of Law at the National Law University, Assam where I am also associated with the Centre for Child Rights. I am a very simple, family loving and God-fearing person. I have my fair share of undesirable traits but in all I try to be a good person. I was good at academics right since my ABCD days but I thoroughly enjoyed my school days, despite all the pressure of doing well in Board exams to getting into whatever it was that I wished to pursue, thanks to my friends. I was not great at sports but I did pretty well at cultural events.

    Studying law, I would say, must be due to pure genetics (my parents are lawyers). On a serious note, I always wanted to be a teacher, never a lawyer or a judge or anything else for that matter.As I grew up, my inclination towards pursuing law followed by a career in academics was but natural. Honestly, there is no particular thing that I can pinpoint as my motivation.

     

    How would you describe your time at NEHU? Tell us about the academic environment and faculty at the law department of the University.

    I had a wonderful time at NEHU as well as the city it is situated in i.e. Shillong. You have to be there to understand why. It is truly the ‘Scotland of the East’. We were the fourth batch to be enrolled in the Department of Law, NEHU and in many ways, we were better off than our seniors in terms of infrastructure, hostels, teachers, library etc. However, we had our fair share of difficulties as well. The academic environment at NEHU is not as hectic as we see at law schools but a lot of effort is put into by a majority of the faculty members in ensuring that the students learn law and are clear with the basic concepts.

     

    Did you take part in extracurricular activities? How important do you think that extra-curricular activities are to a law student?

    I believe, in today’s world, where recruitment is largely based on one’s curriculum vitae, extracurricular activities are very important for any student. Apart from this, as the saying goes, all work and no play makes Jack a dull boy (law-related extracurricular activities are everything but play). Also, extracurricular activities help one in gaining confidence as well as exposure.

    During my preliminary years, I did not have any information about the scope available to a law student, which readily resulted in my lack of inclination towards these activities. Hence, I spent a lot of time on my academic endeavours. My primary objective was to do well in my studies (I was the gold medallist of my batch) and most importantly, learn the basics of as many papers as I could and be thorough with the papers I wished to pursue further (it is not possible to learn every paper thoroughly). However, with the coming of Internet into my life or should I say with the learning of its proper use, things changed (it was difficult to get even phone signals during my initial years at NEHU). I don’t have a long list of activities that I participated in but I participated in the Henry Dunant Memorial Moot Court Competition where I was adjudged the ‘Best Advocate’ and our team was ranked 5th (a big thanks to our teacher who guided us and my dear teammates).

     

    Do you believe that excellent CGPA is absolutely necessary for success?

    It may not be absolutely necessary but its importance cannot be negated at the same time. A decent CGPA gives the much-needed boost to those students who may not be the toppers of their class but do well in other extracurricular activities.

     

    What were your areas of interest during your graduation? How did you go about developing expertise and knowledge in these areas?

    International law and human rights are two areas for which I have nurtured great interest ever since I was pursuing B.A. LL.B. (Hons.). I went on to pursue LL.M. in Human Rights and currently, I am engaged with the teaching of these subjects as well. The only way of developing your knowledge and expertise in any subject is to simply read, read and read.

     

    Did you do any internship during your graduation? Did you receive any assistance from your college?

    Apart from the regular internships with advocates, I interned with the National Human Rights Commission, New Delhi where I won the Best Intern prize.It was a great experience. Department of Law, NEHU did not have any policy to assist students with their internships but the faculty members were kind enough to right letters of recommendation and help in any other manner within their power.

     

    What do you have to say about the supposed ‘elite’ tag attached to certain law schools? Do you believe branding of college is something that’s very relevant/ important at any stage in a law student’s career?

    I don’t think ‘elite’ is the right word to describe these institutions because they were not born elite. Both the faculty and the students of these institutions have made several efforts to bring name and fame to these institutions.

    Given the scenario in today’s time, the brand name of one’s college has indeed attained a position of relevance in a student’s career. While students from renowned colleges are automatically presumed to be good at what they do, students from the not so renowned colleges have to put in a lot of effort to be able to create such presumption in their favour.

     

    When and how did you decide to pursue Masters? Was it a professional requirement or an endeavour out of academic interests?

    I had decided to do pursue Masters even before I joined Bachelors as I had made up my mind at a very young age to become a teacher, although I was not very sure of the subject. When I joined B.A. LL.B., it was only a question of time before I went ahead with Masters towards the fulfillment of my long cherished aim of becoming a teacher. You can call it a professional choice made on the basis of my academic interests.

     

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    You have done your LL.M. from NLSIU, Bangalore. Can you please share your experience at NLSIU? How will you compare the environment at NLSIU with that of NEHU?

    I met some of the finest teachers, students and made some friends for life at NLSIU.Also, NLSIU gave me my first job as a Researcher at the Centre for Women and the Law. One year LL.M. was undoubtedly hectic and it gets over even before you think it has started but it was,although draining at times, an enriching experience. I am still associated with NLSIU as a Ph.D. Scholar.

    Asking me to compare the pedagogy of NLSIU and NEHU are akin to asking someone to differentiate between their two eyes as both are my alma mater.  It may not be actually fair to compare the two given the fact that they are majorly different from each other and represent two different kinds of institutions i.e. one being a National Law School and the other a traditional university.

     

    Looking back, how significant do you think that your legal education was? When did you happen to experience the learning curve?

    Well, I am still a student of law but the legal education I have pursued until now has been quite fruitful in terms of both learning as well as career. However, the main significance of my legal education lies in the fact that I have not lost my interest in it and indeed, have found areas of law, which I am quite interested in pursuing further. Further, with my Ph.D. thesis, I wish to contribute to the largely unexplored field of tribal customary laws and with my teaching, I wish to help students to not only learn but also to retain their interest in learning law.

    I really cannot pinpoint a certain point of time or situation when I experienced the learning curve. It has been a continuous process, I believe right since I started studying law.

     

    When did you exactly decide to take up teaching as your profession? Has it become easier or more difficult for you to understand the psyche of young students in this process of teaching?

    As I have already said, I always wanted to become a teacher.  I cannot recall the exact time I made this decision but as far as I remember, I have always considered teaching as my profession and nothing else. Given the fact that I was myself a student not two months back and that most of my students are my brothers’ age, it has been very easy for me to understand the psyche of my students.

     

    Please tell us about your experience with regard to your first year of work as a PhD scholar at NLSIU? What kind of researches you were entrusted with?

    Well it has not been a year since I registered for Ph.D. at NLSIU but in this period of time, I have had an enriching experience in my many roles as a Research Scholar, a Teaching Assistant as well as a Researcher at the Centre for Women and the Law at NLSIU. Also, given the fact that I was the youngest in the class, I learnt a lot from my fellow scholars during our course work.

    As a Research Scholar, the only research one is required to do is on the topic chosen for writing the thesis. However, the Course work requires one to study Research Methodology and Computer Applications as well.

     

    Please tell us about the requisite soft skills which are essential for a young teacher to build a successful career?

    Apart from a thorough knowledge of the subject that one is entrusted to teach, being humble and humane towards one’s students is of utmost importance. A teacher should always give due regard to the fact that she/he was also once a student and no matter how many years pass, there are certain issues which are common to the students at all times and those need to be addressed humbly and patiently.

     

    Do you feel that there are differences between students of ‘elite’ law schools and students from other law colleges and traditional universities?

    Students are same everywhere but the opportunities available to them make all the difference. I have studied at an elite law school and also at a traditional university. I do not know about others but I could definitely perceive a change in my life. While at NEHU, I had to tell people what NEHU is (That’s ok) but where is NEHU (Shillong? Where’s that? This was frustrating. Geography and G.K. are probably not well taught these days at school). However, these questions disappeared with NLSIU (what a relief). On a more serious note, there is a common misconception among students from traditional universities that law school students are better than them (I too had this misconception) and even among law school students whose law schools are not ranked higher in the law school rank lists and owing to this misconception, they suffer from lack of confidence. In short, opportunities and confidence are the two major differences.

     

    What are your views on the future of Indian legal education? How would you suggest that a law student manages to stay ahead?

    Indian legal education has a bright future ahead but sadly, for only those who can afford the top-most institutions. There are many a good students who will loose a lot owing to this unfortunate situation but that does not mean that they should be discouraged from taking up law. CLAT is not the only way to success although it might seem to be the easiest.

    Going by my own experience, a law student should be informed and thanks to the technological advances, she/he no more requires the college notice board for this purpose. Information is power.

     

    If you could list out 3 activities which on a scale of priority, should be at the top in any law student’s school-life, what would those be?

    Make friends for life (it has nothing to do with law but will help you survive law school and life)

    Concentrate on Academics

    Writing research papers and extracurricular (as per one’s interest and capability)

     

    What would be your advice to young law students? How do you think that they should approach their career?

    Have a lot of fun while at law school but take care not to jeopardize your academic and extracurricular interests in the process. As clichéd as it may sound, but, sincerity and hard work are the essential requisites for an amazing career (a bit of good luck as well).

     

  • Aarthi Sivanandh, Partner, J. Sagar Associates, on building a corporate law practice, merging Vichar Parters and LL.M from Tulane

    Aarthi Sivanandh, Partner, J. Sagar Associates, on building a corporate law practice, merging Vichar Parters and LL.M from Tulane

    Aarthi Sivanandh graduated in commerce from Stella Maris College in 1997 before deciding to pursue law from Tamil Nadu Doctor Ambedkar Law University. Thereafter, she attended Tulane University (US) on a scholarship and graduated the masters course in corporate law with distinction. Soon after she worked in California briefly as a foreign legal consultant before returning to India in 2004. On her return to India she was part of the founding partner team for Universal Legal. In 2010, she co-founded ‘Vichar Partners’ which merged into J.Sagar Associates in April 2014.

    In this interview she tells us about:

    • Degree in Law after commerce and subsequent international exposure
    • Building a corporate law practice in Chennai
    • Experiences in founding a law firm and its merger with Jyoti Sagar Associates
    • Role of a partner at one of the largest firms
    • Work life balance and necessary skills of a young lawyer

     

    You are a B.Com (Hons.) graduate from Stella Maris College. How did you decide to join Tamil Nadu Doctor Ambedkar Law University?

    I never envisioned myself as a lawyer. In my final year of undergrad college at Stella Maris, I had won an advertising competition that awarded me an internship offer at HTA. My mother promptly found me a friend of hers who was a company secretary who persuaded me to join the course lest I am lured by what they believed as the glamorous world of advertising. A short introduction to the intermediate course at the institute and I was captivated by law, thus the road to join the University in Chennai to pursue a degree in law.

     

    Soon after completing LL.B., you went to pursue Masters from Tulane University Law School. Why did you decide to go for higher studies?

    I was interested in corporate law but there were no law firms in Chennai in the late nineties, the city was flooded with court counsels. Litigation was the only thriving practice area and the city was well known for its stellar attorneys’ bar. I decided to visit Bangalore and Mumbai for an internship and found the firms there unwilling to entertain me except for one. It was a struggle to gain exposure to transactional or corporate practice. It was the time after an undergraduate degree when I was keen to discover the world, find new experiences. I had also won two scholarships to study abroad, so I decided to put them to use and get a Masters in Law degree.

     

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    Tell us about your LL.M year at Tulane. How did this influence your career?

    My time at Tulane was rewarding and fun filled, both intellectually and personally. New Orleans is the third most interesting city in the US after New York and San Francisco; this drew me to choose the foreign lawyers LL.M program at Tulane. My class had almost 130 people from more than 25 countries. The historic city that had fought Spanish and French wars, its streetcar and Audubon park still alive from the 1840’s and a milieu of international students was the background in which my mind grew.–

    The enriching dialogues and conversations between professor and student, the Socratic method of teaching, the non-judgmental easy ways that gave every attorney the time to compare how they learnt the law at their home countries and how they articulated themselves, changed my 23 year old mind at very fundamental levels.

    Nothing was unacceptable in the system and there were no wrong answers, there were only ‘different’ answers – This was a huge change from the way I was educated in Chennai.

    I learnt to respect other views, state my own clearly, be financially responsible, manage hard work, independence and be comfortable with strangers. I decided to work in the Valley on graduation and came home after 2 years. And like every person who returns home, I wanted to come back to Chennai and change the way people viewed the firm culture and practice of corporate law.

     

    You have been a corporate lawyer for most of your career. What prompted you to take up corporate law? Share with us any experience which helped you to shape your career choices.

    My late uncle was a real estate lawyer in the 80’s and my father though retired as a public prosecutor continues to work in dispute resolution on a range of matters. I would ask them where companies and others who ran businesses go for their work and they would both reply that those clients’ litigation needs were taken care of in the city but for ‘other work’ they would go to Mumbai or Bangalore or Delhi. While I enjoyed practising with litigation teams in the US (The Chugh Firm), on my return I began to focus only on corporate and transactions law in India and particularly in Chennai.

    The challenge to marry the various nuances of the law with the intricacies of forward looking business is both an opportunity and challenge to the transactions and corporate law practice.

    Many commercial relationships succeed without the fear of legal enforcement simply by relying on the discipline of the parties’ motivation to be fair, their prospect for future dealing, and the increasing premium they place on reputation.

    A quality legal product or service would therefore be one that fine-tunes incentives by providing for a broader range of contingencies that will in turn dramatically reduce the costs of dispute resolution. The challenge to achieve this intricate balance calls upon several skills. This held great appeal for me as a practice area and catered to my need for cleanliness in human and business interaction.

     

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    Considering the fact that you started your career in California, was it easy for you to settle in the work environment of India?

    The style of work communication and managing client expectations were the big differences in the work environments. When I moved to Chennai in 2006 there was still no law firm that was organically grown in Chennai with a true concept of equity or partnership.

    I was a part of Universal Legal in Chennai, India for 4 years that helped me start my career when I moved home. It was an entrepreneurial foray to set up and learn the way forward in term of setting up a practice. However, in many ways there was no ‘senior’ in India whose coat tails I could hold on to, the only choice was to play natural, observe and learn. I settled in easily, it’s a great city and its home. The community places a premium on fair relationships and quality work which were encouraging when I started. Many friendships over the years have given me an insight into the work environment that is unparalleled.

     

    You co-founded Vichar Partners in September, 2010. How did the idea germinate? Any specific reasons why you chose the name “Vichar Partners”?

    I had not always wanted to set up my own firm but one is an amalgam of everything and everyone they meet. The idea of the firm germinated with the usual impatience some lawyers feel in believing that they could fundamentally change things and grow a firm that can have an impact. The energy it required and the excitement of possibilities fuelled me.

    By 2010, I felt I had enjoyed the city, represented and worked with many clients who were willing to work with a non-branded non-legacy firm and had earned the trust of some of the business leaders in the city. I had sporadically but constantly dreamt of an organically grown firm in Chennai, with all its partners in Chennai catering to everything clients need in Chennai had gained momentum. The timing seemed apt when I met my great colleagues and partners Vinod Kumar and Chitra Narayan. Everything seemed ordained and there just seemed no point in waiting anymore.

    We wanted to institutionalise and build a full service law firm and to create a platform that awarded and energised lawyers on merit. We were keen to grow a fast paced technology based law firm that would deal with clients, timelines and quality in an effective manner.

    Our name was coined by to reflect the first 2 letters of each of our names but also that in Sanskrit. Vichar meant an idea, thought or opinion which was what our firm was. We were bound in our commitment to quality and our common belief in the ethical practice of law and business.

     

    In April, 2014, Vichar Partners was merged with Jyoti Sagar Associates, Chennai and you currently work as a Partner at JSA, Chennai. What prompted this merger?

    Vichar Partners entered the market with large aspirations on being the “go-to” firm in Chennai for corporate, commercial, transaction and niche litigation work. We grew considerably well in terms of repute, associate strength and the quality of work we were handling but we did see market realities in a comparatively smaller geography. Talented young corporate lawyers were tough to find in Chennai as the city had deep roots based solely in dispute resolution and transactional work was getting outsourced which meant there was no investment in building younger lawyers in this area, or finding administrative paralegal support to handle large transactions.

    In our third year we found ourselves on other sides of the table with JSA several times, while internally we were intrigued and absorbed on the next level of growth for Vichar. A matter of timing and providence, the potential for a combination seemed complimentary to both our firms.

    Somasekhar from our Mumbai office was a significant influence when he first met us with the idea, later interactions with Murali from our Bangalore office, Amit from our Delhi Office and Dina from our Mumbai office confirmed we were on the right path to considering a merger. Of course, the powerful work ethic and integrity of the leadership of Berjis and Jyoti preceded the reputation of JSA and in the end it was almost a natural selection

    While some may try to refute this, I do believe that large law firms attract the best talent, provide superior training and mentoring, and would transform the inexperienced into an exceptionally skilled attorney. This in turn allows such firms to attract sophisticated clients, handle cutting-edge transactions and manage the greatest deal flows. A combination of these ingredients on a consistent basis offers the best opportunity to develop as a lawyer.

     

    What does a partner at a law firm like JSA do? What falls within the scope of your responsibility? Tell us about a typical work day.

    No day is like another. They are unstructured, sometimes meditative in working through a solution or reactive mode to urgencies or filled with telephone calls. Typically, the day is filled with interactions with potential clients, ongoing work and associates.
    A typical day would start with getting a handle on all the client matters going on, different transactions or other mandates involving opinions or structuring a business, that is either readying itself for a sale or targeting a purchase – the task of managing responses to all of them and understanding if their strategies fit within the walls of the law. I prioritize and coordinate with my colleagues who are working with me based on what stage each transaction or the firm’s involvement is at. Once the background work and schedules are set within the team, active participation in calls or negotiations begin, with each party at the table having multiple commercial requirements and legal must- haves. The forward looking protections that are required in an ever changing commercial background can require one to bring to bear an understanding of economics, commerce, industry and the law.

    Timelines can stretch for various reasons from parties posturing for the right leverage or purely for commercial purposes. The loop repeats and until innovative structuring, alignment of interests and final negotiations find balance– sometimes takes several months.

     

    What is the most challenging or stressful part of being a Partner at one of the most successful law firms in the country? Is it easy to have a work-life balance?

    Challenges are continuous, no piece of work is alike and the constant commercial and market changes require one to keep pace with it and opine within the four corners of the law The challenge is to use the right proportion of legal logic, commercial reasoning and fair persuasion on behalf of a client. Negotiations too are often like a puzzle, you may know where the piece goes but you also have to time when you place the piece in the puzzle so as to let others help you complete it. Being calm and composed in all kinds of crisis situations and timeline based advice is also a challenging aspect of the practice.

    No, it’s not “easy” to have a work life balance. Having said that, I don’t believe work to life balance should be 50-50, at different points of life the balance scale shifts sometimes 60-40 and at other times say 40-60. I have two kids aged 7 & 3 who like to do the typical things kids of that age do– play constantly, run, go to classes etc. With a good support system I manage to do some of it with them but not all. If you think of it all as a part of leading a “whole life” then it makes sense than try to slot each activity into a bucket of either work or life. A true partner/spouse who understands the nature of work can help immensely in keeping this balance. JSA is an even keeled firm, with a great set of people and that makes the road saner and easier.

     

    What kind of effort should a young associate put in to work to get it appreciated? What distinguishes an associate from a partner when it comes to work?

    A young associate should have a keen mind that should be somewhat of a sponge – that absorbs everything in and around, taught and not taught and a thirst to learn. The law school rote method won’t let you stay afloat in a law firm but resourcefulness and hard work will. There are no short cuts.

    The outside world and fresh off the boat lawyers are often enamoured by the pay a corporate practice offers but often fail to see the immense hard work that goes into the practice. There must be a very good reason other than money that makes one want to continue to pump in some very crazy hours, bear with challenging transaction requirements, clients who are bound to be low on patience if they are in stressed commercial situations and to sustain it all, for days to end– it’s a time vampire.

    Associates are central to a Partner’s practice. The more they learn and give the more they grow, the more they grow the Partner can expose them to a variety of work. No show is a one man show, the synchronised timing and effort of the associate team in building research knowledge, knowledge management, prompt interactions with clients on status updates or first level drafts and so can assist the Partner to build on the same to have deeper discussions, develop negotiation strategies, understand commercial requirements and enhance the quality of the practice.

     

    How important would you say are business development skills at such higher roles in a corporate law firm?

    The role of business development is a key component in a law firm. The firm has only one asset – its people. Amongst the people not everyone is required to concentrate on business development but is a requirement on the senior resources. If a senior resource can garner client confidence, provide resourcefulness and deliver as required the firms credibility grows. The larger the pool of senior resources the larger the palette of services the firm can successfully offer. The symbiotic relationship of different partners in the firm are the strong links the firm builds through its people assets in the community. I would say these skills are critical and second to none.

     

    Having a centralised HR what do you have to say about students writing to partners directly?

    JSA is a national law firm and our internship process, recruitment process – all HR functions are centralised. Applications are usually submitted at the internship or careers link on our website. Sometimes, students write to partners or associates they have met or have a relationship with through some other professional forums, while this affords familiarity with the candidate it still depends on the requirement of the location partners and of the firm at each level.

     

    When you hire lawyers under you, what specific skills and profile do you look for?

    Law school education is becoming more adept at providing attorneys with transactional skills. Generally, however, it still falls short. When I hire for my team, I look for students who worked extra hard to find some baseline transactional competencies or have devised ways to achieve them through internships, reading, taking courses at the institutes for extra focus on particular areas of law or part timing at corporate law firms.

    Given where things are in terms of corporate/transactional law practice outside of Mumbai and Delhi and given the gap between law school education and the transactional competencies that are required, it is incumbent upon the lawyer to be competent and take whatever steps necessary to educate herself to become so.

    Fresh graduates can build on their ability to understand business associations, basic advice about business structures, and draft documents related to business associations and secondly to investigate and understand facts and research the law in a given context (emphasis on due diligence).

    Working lawyers or lateral hires in addition to the above should be able to draft clearly, have thorough research skills, be able to walk a colleague or client through the process of identifying what the issues are, rules of law in play given the issues, applicability of law to the issues and finally a conclusion. They must be able to also identify and address the ethical implications of practice.

     

    What would be your advice to students who wish to go for higher studies?

    A degree for the sake of it would serve no end. However, some are geared to appreciating the jurisprudential thought involved and understand nuances better when the learning is organized through curriculum while others are adept to picking it up as they work with counsels or at law firms. A higher education abroad gives an exposure early on in a student’s career to the different styles practices and legal markets in the world. In my personal experience, these courses often help in wide network of friends in different regions and a style in writing and thought that could be unparalleled but I would not unduly overemphasise the need for a practitioner to obtain a master of laws degree.

     

    What would be your message to our readers who are budding lawyers and law students?

    Clarity in thought and expression is the single most important quality for a practising lawyer today. This assists in honing the ability to identify, evaluate, and understand business risks for clients and in turn offer appropriate legal advice. Invest in yourself constantly, by reading and understanding the rules of law both at home and abroad, this will enable one to compare contrast and therefore learn. The law is known to be a jealous mistress; you will have to give a lot to get some.

  • Namrata Chatterjee, Associate, Shardul Amarchand Mangaldas, on leaving law firm for FIFA masters, studying law at NLU Jodhpur and cracking job interview

    Namrata Chatterjee, Associate, Shardul Amarchand Mangaldas, on leaving law firm for FIFA masters, studying law at NLU Jodhpur and cracking job interview

    Namrata Chatterjee is a graduate from National Law University, Jodhpur (2013 batch). She worked with Amarchand Mangaldas & Suresh Shroff & Co, Delhi (now Shardul Amarchand Mangaldas) for around two years and has just left the organization to pursue the FIFA Master Program; a masters in humanities, management and law of sports, on a full tuition fee waiver. We asked her to share her law school and work experiences, and reasons for leaving one of the best jobs in the country.

    In this interview, she talks about:

    • Law school experience at NLU Jodhpur and all about balancing Academics with co-curricular
    • Cracking AMSS interview, work experience at AMSS and the first year of graduation
    • Applying for the FIFA Masters programmer and qualifying for full tuition waiver

     

    How would you introduce yourself? Could you please share a little bit of what motivated you to pursue law as a career?

    Hi, I am Namrata Chatterjee, a graduate of the 2013 batch of National Law University, Jodhpur. I worked with Amarchand Mangaldas & Suresh Shroff & Co, Delhi (now Shardul Amarchand Mangaldas) for around two years and have just left the organisation to pursue the FIFA Master Program; a master in humanities, management and law of sports, on a full scholarship (full tuition fee waiver).

    To be honest, Law was never my first choice career option. I had taken up the science stream and was preparing for the engineering entrance exams during my XIth and XIIth standard. Though a lack of passion in the subjects I was pursuing made me realize it would be a mistake to keep continuing down a path which wouldn’t give me work satisfaction. Hence, I then decided to pursue law. The fact that my father, who is in the Civil Services also has a law degree and my mother is also a lawyer, though she left practice a long while back had me interested in the legal profession. Though ultimately, the decision to take up law came after my elder sister, Amrita Chatterjee commenced her legal studies at NUJS, Kolkata. Therefore, while giving CLAT, my first choice was NUJS so that I could study in the same college as my sister, after studying in the same school, D.P.S R.K. Puram together.

    However, as luck would have it, I did not get through NUJS and made it to NLU, Jodhpur instead. Initially I was unhappy about the same, but in hindsight I feel it was a great thing to have happened to me as studying in a different college than my sister gave me a lot of different exposure and surely made me much more independent in life.

     

    How did you make the initial shift from a science background to law? Would you say it was difficult settling in?

    I had taken up the science stream as that was the most encouraged field to be taken up after securing over 90% in my class Xth Board exams. Though once I did take up science, I began to realize that a career in engineering wasn’t my real calling. Though when I made the shift to law, there again I got the option of taking up B.A/B.BA/B.SC (LL.B) in NLU, Jodhpur. However, this time around I decided to go with the pure social sciences and opted for B.A LL.B (Hons). Though there was one thing about the science stream that helped me in my legal studies and that was the enhanced logical reasoning skills and the propensity to question. So, I would say, it was never difficult for me to settle into legal studies.

     

    Tell us about your college life at NLUJ. What all activities did you partake in?

    In a sentence, College life at NLU, Jodhpur has given me memories of a lifetime. Though, I took a little time to settle down in Jodhpur initially having lived in Delhi for most part of my life. However, soon I became used to the quaint environment of Jodhpur. NLU, Jodhpur not only stressed on academics, wherein we had continuous assessments throughout the semester along with presentations and compulsory court room exercises in the law subjects, it also gave ample opportunities for interested students to take up mooting, debates, MUN’s, cultural activities and sports among other things. In fact, if likeminded students got together, they had the independence to start a lot of interesting activities etc. I participated in MUN’s and paper presentations and that helped us to travel along with getting a good exposure.

     

    Please tell us about the manner in which you approached academics while in college. Please share some highlights from your college days that shaped you as a lawyer.

    I always took academics seriously. I maintained a good CGPA throughout the five years. Though I’ll be honest, I did not pay attention to everything that was taught in class always and rarely ever took notes. Rather, only subjects of my interest and especially the classes taught by some of the teachers who made the classes rather engaging caught my full attention. However, to prepare for the continuous tests and exams, I always studied in groups and studied from the notes taken by my friends and generally always fared well in the exams. I would not have specific highlights that shaped me as a lawyer, but it was more of a gradual process, being aware of your rights and trying to reason with the teachers and administration to convince them, debates and discussions with my friends and finding evidence to back my points amongst other things shaped me as a lawyer.

     

    A lot of law students in their first and second year of law school plan to change the legal regime of India. Many of them promise themselves to work pro-bono on social issues, curb menaces and threats to the society. Have you ever felt that kind of thought crossing you?

    Yes, I wouldn’t deny these thoughts having crossed my mind at several occasions. Not just during college but even when I worked at Amarchand. Sometimes a cab driver while dropping me to the High Court would seek my legal advice or my house maid would approach me with a legal dispute and at those moments, I kept feeling the need to give back to the society and help the under-privileged with whatever legal knowledge I have. However, to be able to do some pro-bono work, firstly I think it is important to gain more knowledge, work experience and the resources to truly be in a position to help others and yes, if possible someday if not full time, I would hope to assist in some way in taking up pro-bono matters in whatever field I am pursuing.

     

    How did you fare in your academics at NLUJ? Would you say a great CGPA is a necessity to kickstart a good career in the legal profession?

    I maintained a consistent CGPA in college and stood within the top ten percent of my batch. A good CGPA is not the only measure to secure a good career in the legal profession. Interest in what you pursue and working hard in internships and other extra-curricular activities help as well. However, as the recruitment scenario of the big law firms go, if you have a good CGPA, it helps you to get shortlisted for the interview comparatively easily. Though maintaining a good CGPA is hard work in itself. However, that gives you the leeway from the stress of securing a PPO through the internships. Further, moot courts, publications and such activities does help in building a good CV, but as I can say from my own example, these things are not necessary to secure a good job. I only participated in one moot late into my 4th year that too since it was a moot in IPR, a subject of my interest and I did not have any publications during law school. So, it is not necessary to participate in a lot of moots etc. However, if you are interested in them, taking them up would be an added benefit. However, a good CGPA and a good interview helped me to secure a job at Amarchand.

     

    Which subjects did you enjoy during your qualifying degree? How did you go about developing expertise and knowledge in these areas?

    I particularly enjoyed the Intellectual Property Rights and related law subjects the most in law school. I even took up IPR as my specialisation or honours subject. Though, even more than IPR, I was passionate about sports law. From my childhood, I have loved sports and this field of sports law gave me a chance to explore the interplay of sports and law. However, sports law as a subject was not taught in my college. Therefore, to pursue my interest in the field, I constantly kept reading websites like lawinsport and pursued internships in the field. I even mentored some of my juniors in sports law under the academic mentorship program initiated by some of the students in my college. In furtherance of this interest, I even took up sports law as my seminar paper in my final semester. Even in IPR, I was more interested in copyright and trademarks as opposed to patents and I constantly kept reading, writing and researching on the congruence of IPR and sports law. Even for the research paper/projects we had to develop in most of the subjects taught in college, I would try to write them on sports related topics.

     

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    How did you plan your internships? How relevant did you find your law school education with the kind of work you were required to do at law firms?

    I actively planned to take up at least one internship in a year. I never over burdened myself with internships as I always wanted to keep some time off to spend with my family and friends at home. However, I pursued internships keeping my interests in mind. In my first year, I interned at NHRC, subsequently I pursued litigation internships with advocates and law firms like Luthra & Luthra and Parekh & Co. Though from my third year onwards, I started streamlining my internships even further to explore and gain experience in areas I was most interested in, being IPR and sports law. Therefore, I interned at Law Offices of Nandan Kamath, a boutique sports law firm in Bangalore and Copyright Integrity International. I even interned with Retd. Justice Mukul Mudgal and gained firsthand experience of interesting work in sports law.

    Law school education is the foundation to develop how you interpret the laws and the approach towards legal thinking. Though from experience, I would say that we learn more on the job than we learn in law school.

     

    Did you find that your law school education had prepared you sufficiently for the many tasks you were required to execute during your internships and later at your job?

    As I just said, law school education helps you to develop a legal thinking and good researching skills. Further, the subjects that one takes interest in law school, those subjects and certain landmark cases therein stays with us always. However, we learn most subjects and topics on the job when we are faced with a practical situation regarding the same. In a way, the curriculum at NLU, Jodhpur and the continuous tests, mid-terms, vivas, projects, presentations, moots throughout the semester prepared us to work late into the night when required and meet deadlines in any manner and these things surely help us to be prepared with the work life and expectations at your job.

     

    Soon after graduation, you joined AMSS as an Associate. How did your appointment take place? What worked for you in securing the job?

    I got placed at AMSS at day zero of our placements that year. I had never interned at AMSS before so did not know what to really expect there. However, I was shortlisted for the interview based on my CV and my good CGPA I believe. I think my interview happened very comfortably and I was confident throughout the interview and that helped me secure the job. As also, as I have previously mentioned, a good CGPA, some varied and good internship experiences and participation in paper presentations and such activities helped my case.

     

    How was the job interview? Do you remember any of the questions asked to you? Please give our readers some tips to nail a law firm interview.

    The first round of my job interview was the group discussion round and we got to discuss and debate on the Indian Premier League, since I am very passionate about sports, the topic put me at complete ease. Post the GD, we had a personal interview round which was a mix of HR and technical questions. Though, I would really like to mention that staying calm and comfortable in an interview really helps. Even if you are unsure about a particular question, put it across to them that this is what you think and tell them that on this particular point you may not be completely sure. However, the subjects you are interested in and things mentioned in your CV about projects or internships, those things one should be aware of while preparing for the interview. Know your CV well and what you tell them you are interested in and at least show that you have taken some steps towards your interest. Further, for the HR questions don’t make up answers or take long to think and answer rather use your wit and give appropriate answers, it would surely help.

     

    How was your first year after graduation? What do you think were the biggest hurdles and challenges in the early days of your career? How did you deal with them?

    The first year, more so the first six months in your job are the most difficult. If one can mentally survive through the challenges that come up in the initial phase of your job, it becomes easier to handle pressure further. Since, in AMSS they had a policy of rotation for the fresh graduates who joined them; I was placed in a corporate team for the first phase post joining AMSS before being ultimately placed in the litigation/dispute resolution department. However, since I was always interested in pursuing litigation in AMSS and having never really interned in a corporate law team in any of my previous internships, I was not very comfortable in starting my career doing corporate law. Therefore, initially I took time to settle down, took more time to complete assignments, though some of the seniors understanding my position really guided me well. So, it is very important to get good seniors to guide you initially and one should not hesitate to ask questions and soon one figures out the expectations of their seniors and how to handle timelines without compromising quality.

     

    What kind of work and responsibilities does an Associate at AMSS deal with?

    In the first year of my time at AMSS, being in the corporate department, my work responsibilities included research, assisting in drafting responses and opinions and assisting in drafting due diligence reports, though once I shifted to the litigation department, my work responsibilities increased due to shorter deadlines before court hearings. Most of my work responsibilities included research, drafting the first draft of some of the pleadings and counsel briefing notes as well as providing assistance in counsel briefings and court hearings. Also, we are expected to know the files well and be adept at paper management in briefings and hearings to aptly assist our seniors. Due to large number of matters across various judicial forums, in a lot of matters I got the chance to go to courts by myself for filing as well as minor appearances.

     

    Tell us about a case that you are particularly proud of. What steps do you take to prepare for a difficult case?

    There have been one or two high profile cases I have been involved in and due to the high stakes of those matters, it has been very interesting to work in them. The biggest advantage I felt of working in Amarchand was the diversity of matters and especially the big matters that we got involved in. These matters involved various complex questions of law and gave us a chance to closely work with senior counsels and adopt their good practices as well.

    Difficult cases require extensive research and thinking out of the box. One should always keep thinking of innovative arguments and put forth their views to their seniors.

     

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    What has been your strategy to deal with errors and mistakes?

    It is only human to err. Even I have made some errors and mistakes in my time at the firm, but dealing with them and finding quick fixes is one more thing this job has taught me. In fact, I would say along with work experience, this job has taught me more of life experiences. In terms of mistakes, I can give an example, say, if at all I would forget to bring copies of an important case law to the court, I would go to the court library and secure copies of the same before the damage is done. Therefore, it is important to reach for conferences and court a little before time and know your bags and papers well, so that these kinds of errors can be fixed within time. However, if you have made mistakes which you cannot easily fix, always bring it to the notice of your seniors so that they can use their experience for crisis management rather than hiding it from your seniors.

     

    How do you keep yourself abreast with latest industry news and trends?

    It is indeed important to be abreast with latest news in our profession. Reading the newspaper daily helps in this regard. So many times while researching for a case, I can remember reading about similar cases in the newspaper and then that helps with finding relevant and recent cases. It is also important to keep reading articles and SCC Online etc for the latest cases especially the landmark ones that come up. It is also very important to check the current position of law regarding every proposition one has to argue for their case.

     

    There is a considerable attrition rate at the top law firms, what do you think contributes to this? What has been your personal experience?

    The attrition rate is considerably high at the top law firms because the work pressure is surely a lot. Also, it more so depends on the reason one enters the law firm. Some people come to gain some good work experience before proceeding for their masters, which is somewhat my own case as well. While some people cannot deal with the daily demands and stringent deadlines, some people after joining realize this is not their interest area and move towards what they are really interested in. However, this is true that if one wants a less hectic life and most of their weekends free and finds it difficult to maintain the quality of work in extremely short deadlines, then it is difficult to continue in a big law firm.

    Personally also, after working here for around two years, I am now moving on to pursue my masters in a field which I have always been keenly interested in, i.e sports law. I applied to colleges and courses specifically providing for masters in IPR or sports law and applied and secured admission to University of Zurich, ISDE Madrid, George Washington University and the FIFA Master program and even secured a scholarship everywhere. So once I received the full scholarship (full tuition fee waiver) at the FIFA Master program, I knew it was time for me to pursue a field I am more interested in and the experience at Amarchand would definitely help me everywhere ahead. So, my reason for leaving the organisation was that though I was doing good litigation work, it did not involve a lot of sports related disputes and I wanted to always pursue my masters post getting a couple of years work experience.

     

    Life for lawfirmites can be very hectic at times. What is your take on work-life balance? How do you unwind?

    Yes, life at a law firm is hectic but during court vacations, things are less hectic and most people take their leaves at that time. I feel it is very important to have a work life balance; otherwise one tends to lose interest in their work and is busy dealing with deadlines and stress rather than enjoying what they do. So, as much as possible one should relax as well as go out with their family and friends on the weekends and try and avoid getting work back home, unless the situation really demands for it. Even in office, one should take small breaks to interact with their friends and walk around a bit to avoid sitting at their desk at a stretch for long hours.

     

    How did you decide to leave a cushy law firm job for the FIFA Masters programme? Please tell us about the programme and how you got gravitated towards it.

    I agree, it isn`t an easy decision to make when it comes to leaving a secured and well paying job for an uncertain path. However, I did what I feel will give me the right platform to pursue my field of interest.

    I have been a sports buff since my childhood. My father always found a partner in me to watch matches with him and then engage in endless discussions about various players and game strategies! Therefore, once I took law, it was only natural that sports law caught my attention the most. Now, to try and succeed in a sports related field, it is important that I obtain the right exposure and specialised knowledge. In that regard, the FIFA master fit my requirements perfectly.

    The FIFA master program is an international M.A teaching three different aspects which form the core of working in a sports related field, being humanities of sports, management of sports and law in sports.

    The first module is the humanities module which takes place in DeMontfort University, Leicester and covers aspects relating to the history and development of sports and sports organizations. The second module is the management module and is held at SDA Bocconi school of Management, Milan and the last module of the 10 months program is the law module dealing with the legal aspects of sports, dispute resolution, ethical issues in sports etc, to be held at University of Neuchatel, Switzerland. The final degree is awarded by all the three partner universities in association with CIES and FIFA.

    Along with the classroom teaching and guest lectures, the program also includes field visits to various sports clubs and organizations like FIFA, UEFA etc in order to learn about their fuctioning, marketing, governing regulations etc from the relevant experts.

    I have decided to undertake this program as along with sports law, this also widens my arena to cover management of sports which are upcoming fields in India and post completion of this masters, hopefully I would be able to contribute to further developments in these fields.

     

    How did you manage to get a full tuition fee waiver? Could you please detail the procedure in details?

    The option to apply for the scholarship is present in the main application itself and the selection procedure for the course takes place in two stages. If one is shortlisted based on the application, they then have to give an interview to be finally selected. So, during my interview I was told that they generally do not give the full tuition fee waiver scholarship to one person rather look towards dividing it amongst a few students. However, post the interview which wasn`t really a technical one, when I was finally informed of my selection, I was also informed that I have been awarded the full tuition fee waiver. The scholarship is given on the basis of need as well as merit.

     

    The question that whether one should specialise in a particular area of law or be more of a general lawyer often comes up before law students. What is your opinion on the same?

    I am going to pursue the FIFA Master program which in itself is a very specialised and unique course. This is a program organised by CIES and FIFA and taught by three partner universities being De Montfort University, SDA Bocconi School of Management and University of Neuchatel across England, Italy and Switzerland respectively. This program teaches the most relevant inter-disciplinary fields related to sports-humanities, management and law of sports. This program would surely enhance my knowledge and interest of sports law and along with it would also open the ambit of sports management if I choose to pursue the same. I agree, leaving a secure job and going to do something so niche might be a bit of a risk. However, I believe one should at least try to pursue what they love rather than keep regrets in life. So, particularly I feel if one has figured that they are interested in a specific field over the others and performs their best while dealing with work in that area then they would always enjoy what they do and get appropriate outcomes too. Working on laws that one does not find interesting, like I never enjoyed corporate laws doesn’t help in one’s growth and development as a lawyer. So, it is important to start as a general lawyer but if you feel there are some areas you enjoy more than the others, I would suggest and encourage one to pursue them further.

     

    What would be your parting message to law students?

    Work hard, enjoy what you do and don’t be afraid to take risks and explore options.

     

  • Prem Jumani, Associate, Banking & Finance, ALMT Legal on being a Company Secretary and Lawyer and on law school experience at GLC Bombay

    Prem Jumani, Associate, Banking & Finance, ALMT Legal on being a Company Secretary and Lawyer and on law school experience at GLC Bombay

    Prem Jumani graduated with B.Com. degree from Mumbai University before joining GLC, Mumbai in 2008. Meanwhile he also managed to pursue CS degree. While pursuing law, he worked at Shree Ram Urban Infrastructure Limited as an Assistant Company Secretary.Soon after graduation, he started working at Batliboi Ltd as an Executive – Legal & Secretarial. Thereafter, he also worked at Kamal & Co. Advocates, Solicitors & Notary and Solomon & Co. Advocates & Solicitors. In 2014, he joined ALMT Legal as an Associate in their Banking & Finance and General Corporate team. In the same year, he was awarded with  the title of Rising Star of the 2014 Corporate Intl Magazine Global Award as ‘Corporate Compliance Lawyer of the Year in India’.

     

    Why did you decide to study Law? What inspired you to do so? How did you get through to GLC, Mumbai?

    My dad was a biggest inspiration for me, who made choose law as my career. Initially I took up law as a supportive degree to Company Secretary (CS). A law with CS is a very good combination for a corporate lawyer. Luckily my score on the board after my commerce graduation in 2008 was good enough to make my place in the merit list of GLC. Since GLC is the oldest law school of Mumbai and holds a huge reputation of building good lawyers it was my first preference in Mumbai.

     

    What were your areas of interest during your graduation? How did you go about developing expertise and knowledge in these areas?

    My interest was always corporate and commercial laws as I was pursuing CS during my graduation. I was interning with one of the leading infrastructure listed company which gave me a good base of corporate secretarial and capital market practice. Later on, as and when I moved ahead the attitude of ‘never say never’ helped me to get opportunities to do good amount of matters like private equity, acquisitions, banking finance and litigation.

     

    What do you feel about the perception that students of certain ‘elite’ NLU’s have a much easier time in kick-starting their career as compared to law students from other colleges? Is this true at all?

    Yes, it matters quite alot from which college one has done a graduation, but at the same time it may not possible for everyone to get into NLSIU or NLU. For getting a good start it is preferable that law students must do internships from second year onwards or even sign solicitors, if they wish to do so.

     

    After graduation, you joined Batliboi Ltd. as an Executive – Legal & Secretarial and later switched to assist Mr. Bulchandani – Counsel at High Court. What was the nature of your work at both these places? How would you describe your work experience as?

    My role at Batliboi Limited was more of corporate secretarial than legal. I felt that a job of company secretary was more of monotonous than a challenging work, I always enjoyed the legal assignments I use to get, but the scope of work was very limited in Batliboi for me. It was then a point of realisation for me that I want be a lawyer and take up the challenging assignments.

    Thus the hunt for finding a place in a law firm law started for me, but it was never easy for me to get in the law firms initially. I had never interned with any of the law firms earlier. After getting rejected by almost all the top tier law firms, I got a chance to assist Mr. Bulchandani in litigation matters at Hon’ble High Court of Mumbai and that’s how I did litigation.

    At the chambers of Mr. Bulchandani my work profile was to support him in each and every matter that was handled by him. I was given an opportunity to work on various matters with a wide scope. I generally use to assist him for High Court and Arbitration matters or even SEBI matter. At times I was pushed for appearing independently in small matters and I was developing a confidence in handling matters at trial courts. The work experience was undoubtedly fantastic with Mr. Bulchandani, but a pinch of moving from a handsome salary of Batliboi to a stipend was really big for me.

     

    You also had the opportunity to work as an Associate- Corporate Lawyer at Solomon & Co. Advocates & Solicitors. What kind of work you were entrusted with at Solomon and Co.?

    The work profile at Solomon & Co. was again very enormous for me. I had an opportunity to do vide range of matters like acquisitions, Indian Entry, corporate compliance, litigation, capital markets, private equity, etc. Above all Mr. Aaron Solomon is a very sharp lawyer and gem person to work with and I really admire him as a lawyer.

     

    Currently you work as an Associate in the General Corporate and Banking Finance team of ALMT Legal, Mumbai. How did you appointment take place? What do they look for in their prospective employees?

    My appointment in ALMT was by way of a chance, there was a panel of 4 partners who interviewed me and subsequently within a week I got selected and was asked to join the firm.  ALMT is a good growing law firm and gives a chance to lot of young lawyers a good platform to build their base. One needs to be honest, sincere and hard working for a good future and ALMT expects the same from its associates.

     

    What kind of work and responsibilities generally an associate at ALMT Legal deals with? What is a typical workday like?

    We generally deal with end to end responsibility in a transaction so right from a stage one to the closing of transaction everything is been handled by an associate. As far as what work a associate handles depends upon his or her expertise and interest.

    At times it’s hectic and we don’t even get a breathing space as any other law firm, but sometimes when we are light on work we make lots of news flash and update ourselves.

     

    What is the current scenario of studying corporate law as a career option in India? What are the key qualities one should posses for becoming a corporate lawyer?

    Corporate law has a very scope and includes various verticals of practice like private equity, capital markets, M&A, banking finance, corporate secretarial, tax practice, etc. In order to be a corporate lawyer one needs to have an interest and willingness of doing this subjects and it is better to have an additional qualification of a CA or CS or even MBL (Masters of Business Laws) which can give a good base.

     

    What have been the highlights of your job so far? What does it take to be a good corporate lawyer?

    I believe the diversity of matters is the major highlight of my career so far, as I have worked as a litigator, company secretary, private equity lawyer, capital markets lawyer and at time banking lawyer.

    Corporate law is not a rocket science but it takes smart and hard work plus a handy knowledge of subjects like contact law, CPC, companies act, SEBI, banking laws, etc. to be a good corporate lawyer.

     

    What has been your strategy to deal with errors and mistakes? How would you suggest a young associate to deal with them?

    Errors and mistakes are the part and parcels of your life, you can’t avoid them and that’s the only way to gain experience. The strategy is to overcome the mistakes by analysing and understanding them and not running away from a situation.

     

    How do you think a CS degree can prove to be useful in a lawyer’s career in the current as well as future market?

    Undoubtedly, CS qualifications help alot in understanding and dealing the situation.

    CS syllabus helps you to learn subjects of capital market and general corporate in-depth plus a qualification which gives you some accounting and finance knowledge. Though we lawyers do not concentrate on figures much, it helps me to understand better in client meetings at times.

     

    How do you manage to strike a balance between your personal and professional life?

    Its quiet simple for me because me and my wife both are in the same field and understand each other quiet well. We generally spend good weekends together which help us to manage our personal life better.

     

    What do you feel makes an intern stand out and is very important for him to do to have a chance of getting a call back or even a PPO?

    Internship in ALMT depends upon the requirements from time to time. A hard work is very important, one needs to ask alot of questions and analyse each and everything in the manner to understand why the things are done in particular way.

     

    Given a chance to turn back the clock would you have done anything differently from what you’ve done?

    I realised lot of things late in my life. I wasted lots of initial days, which I feel could have turned around my career a bit.

     

    What would be your message to a law student who is yet to decide his/her career?

    Internships and hard work are the key to success for future.

     

  • George Pothan, Legal Consultant, Ministry of External Affairs, on work experience, LL.M from King’s College and studying law at JSS, Mysore

    George Pothan, Legal Consultant, Ministry of External Affairs, on work experience, LL.M from King’s College and studying law at JSS, Mysore

    George Pothan Poothicote graduated from Christ College, Bangalore with a B.Com degree before going on to complete his LL.B from JSS Law College, Mysore by 2010. While in law school he interned at several places including Ernst & Young and High Court of Kerala. He pursued an LL.M from King’s College, London and finished his masters by 2012. Immediately after completing his LL.M he came back to India and was appointed as Legal Consultant to Legal and Treaties Division, Ministry of External Affairs, Govt. of India, New Delhi and he is currently working there.

    In this interview he talks about:

    • Law school experience at Mysore University.
    • LL.M from King’s College, London.
    • Internships, recruitment and work at Ministry of External Affairs

     

    How would you introduce yourself? Tell us a bit about your pre law-college years. What motivated you to study law?

    Born in Mysore, I spent my early childhood dividing time between Mysore and Wayanad, and thereafter left to board at Montfort School, situated in Yercaud, a hill station in Tamil Nadu. I went on to do my B.Com at Christ College, Bangalore, LL.B at JSS Law College, Mysore and LL.M at King’s College, London.

    Hailing from a family of lawyers, I grew up imbibing into my very system the lawyers’ lingo and vernacular, and naturally felt drawn to the profession. Therefore, it was a firm and solid choice to become a lawyer myself.

     

    How would you describe your time at Mysore University? Tell us about the academic environment and faculty at the law department of the University.

    The experience was intense and extremely enriching. The student body was intellectually dynamic, with representatives from around the country and even abroad. The faculty included both full time academics and professional practitioners. They were very approachable, and inspired hope, ignited imagination and instilled a love of learning in their students.

     

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    Did you take part in activities apart from your regular curriculum? What all did you do as a law student?

    I participated in practical applications of what I learned, and textbooks gradually came to be of secondary importance to me. In conference settings, at moot courts and in practical classes, I had the opportunity to observe stellar lawyers and law students and noted how effective they were as participants, not only because they possessed superior knowledge, but also because they seemed to instinctively know how to handle a variety of difficult scenarios. Every evening of my final year, I visited the chambers of a senior advocate in Mysore. Also, every Saturday that year, I travelled to a village 35 kilometers from the city to provide free legal aid services and out-of-court settlements, as well as to spread legal awareness.

    My participation in National and International moot court competitions ignited my passion for the field of international law and also enabled me to interact with students and faculty from around the world. I assisted in research work for the scion of the Mysore royal family in the dispute over assets of the royal family and the abolition of the Privy Purse. Later, I helped to draft an anti-ragging bill which was presented to the then Governor of Karnataka. I also represented the college in various seminars and conferences.

    While being good in academics was the most important function during my days at law school, engaging in extracurricular pursuits was a close second. I did indulge in sports and had the privilege of representing my class and college teams in cricket and volleyball.

    My objective during my LLB days was to do my best whilst maintaining a healthy balance and letting other things beyond my control take care of themselves.

     

    Do you believe that excellent CGPA is absolutely necessary for success?

    An excellent CGPA, or any other measure of academic record, can assist in furthering academic pursuits and optimizing the initial recruiting process. That said, the microcosm of university and the world at large are as different as chalk and cheese. In universities one learns the theoretical aspects of law, but for success in the practical applications of the work environment, top grades are not a prerequisite.

     

    What were your areas of interest during your graduation (LL.M)? How did you go about developing expertise and knowledge in these areas?

    Constitution, Criminal Law, Arbitration and International Law were some of the subjects that interested me during my LL.B days. The experience I gained through moot courts, assignments and conferences, as well as my interactions with a number of inspiring people, led me to develop a particular fascination for International Law, both private and public.

    I had long been keen on pursuing an LL.M in International Law, but participated in a variety of modules before finalizing my subjects. My subjects were a combination of Public and Private International Law and International Commercial and Business Law, which may appear to be quite a broad spectrum for the course level. However, the subjects were not as disparate they seem. They included Terrorism and State Violence, World Trade Law, Use of Force, Commercial and Investment Arbitration, and Negotiation. What is especially interesting is the intimate relationship between International Law and Diplomacy. My curriculum combined both.

     

    Please tell us about your internships during your graduation.

    Internships and building work experience had been a consistent part of my academic pursuits during my years as a law student. At the end of my first year in law school, I was able to reinforce my tax related knowledge through an internship with Ernst & Young in their Global Tax Analysis service department in Bangalore. At the end of my second year of law school, I gained invaluable court experience with Honourable Justice R. Basant, a Senior Judge at the High Court of Kerala. I shadowed him closely and was privy to the procedures of the chambers of a High Court Judge, which gave me access to the judge’s files, notes and discussions. I felt particularly privileged as this was a rare opportunity for a student.

    During my final year, I visited the chamber of Advocate KL Sugandhi, a senior advocate in Mysore, which involved interacting with clients, learning procedures and even contributing to work on the cases.

     

    Do you believe branding of college is something that’s very relevant/ important at any stage in a law student’s career?

    Branding seems to have become as inevitable in the field of education as in business. That said, it should be taken with a bucket of salt. Power on the professional battlefield is determined by hard work and dedication above all.

     

    When and how did you decide to pursue Masters? Was it a professional requirement or an endeavour out of academic interests?

    From the beginning of my law education, I had entertained the idea of pursuing an LL.M degree. That said, I never viewed it as a professional requirement, as I had initially been keen on a career in litigation, for which an LL.B would suffice. Over the course of my LLB, I pondered over the subjects I would like to pursue, and shortlisted the Universities that seemed best suited to my interests.  The LL.M was a great adventure that enabled me to set sail to shores more magnificent than I had ever imagined.

     

    You have done your LL.M. from Kings College London. Please share your experience. Any other university which offers a similar combination of modules?

    It was simply amazing. I was taught and inspired by some of the best professionals in their respective fields: Professors. Martin Hunter, Salim Moollan, Samuel Wordsworth, Dr. Federico Ortino and Dr. Piet Eechout, to name a few. I still am in touch with most of them both at personal and professional levels. Whenever I felt the need for an expert opinion or guidance, these professors were most helpful. The course combined theory with practical applications. The whole system was different from what I was familiar with at the LL.B level. In addition to textbook learning, there were group discussions, debates and lots of interactive sessions, with an emphasis on research. We were encouraged to write papers and discuss them.

    I still have fond memories of a workshop conducted by Prof. Martin Hunter, visits to his chambers at Essex Court Chambers and a Friday clinic he used to organise. Another unforgettable experience is the time I spent at the WTO, where I was able to interact with key people of the WTO Secretariat and Country representatives, and gain valuable insight into the incredible operations of such a hallowed institution.

    There are other Universities that offer such modules, but I am not in a position to recommend them.

     

    How will you compare the pedagogy at Mysore University with that of King’s College, London?

    Comparing the pedagogy at Mysore University and King’s College is tricky because I attended them at two completely different levels. The LL.B is a basic degree in law, structured primarily to meet the general requirements of practitioners in the field. An LL.M is an additional qualification that involves specialization, and as such the structure of the LL.M diverges from that of the LL.B.  During my LLB, most of my professors were full time faculty, whereas during my LL.M, the majority of lecturers were practitioners in their respective fields, and their experience and expertise did make a difference.  A good teacher always brings out the best in his/her students. I consider myself lucky to have been mentored by the right kind of teachers.

    Diversity was perhaps the most significant difference between the two programs. At King’s College, the faculty and the University at large catered to a crowd from across the globe. The student community at Mysore University was primarily Indian.

     

    Looking back, how significant do you think that your legal education was? When did you happen to experience the learning curve?

    I believe that my education in its entirety has made me who I am today. My legal education in particular has been significant in shaping my career, and my analytical view of the world.

    As I see it, the learning curve starts from the earliest stages of life. Every single day has presented learning opportunities. I think, therefore I am; I live, therefore I learn. The slope of my learning curve in the legal field took a surge towards the latter part of my LL.M program, and continued to steepen when I entered the Ministry of External Affairs, where I have interacted with some of the best legal minds in the country and around the world. The Senior Official Meetings, Ministerial Meetings and Summits of which I have been a part were incredible experiences. One particular case that gave impetus to my learning curve was a brief I received from Mr. Gourab Banerji, the then Additional Solicitor General of India, during my early days at the Ministry. It was my first significant case, and it was an exciting challenge. More recently, I have had the privilege of being involved with the Law Commission of India in its work on investment treaties, which has been quite insightful.

    I look forward to the continuing intellectual stimulation of my work. Learning is an integral part of the profession, as it shifts like the sands of time.

     

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    You joined Ministry of External Affairs as a Legal Consultant; what worked for you in getting appointed?

    I assume that my academic pursuits and passion for the profession, in addition to the support I received from the then External Affairs Minister, Mr. Salman Khurshid, who had faith in my ability and trusted me with such great responsibility, led to my appointment.

     

    What are the career opportunities at MEA like?

    The MEA provides excellent opportunities for those interested in the international dimensions of law. We deal with treaty negotiations and international law disputes. Diplomacy is integral to the mix. That said, our work is not exclusively on an international level, as we do examine domestic law issues on occasion.

     

    Are Legal Consultants allowed foreign postings? How does their work interact with that of the Indian Foreign Service?

    Foreign postings are certainly available to those belonging to the Legal Cadre of the MEA. The Hague headquarters the International Court of Justice and the Permanent Court of Arbitration. Geneva and New York City are bases for numerous international organisations.

    The responsibilities of international law and diplomacy require a great amount of interaction with foreign service officers and other government representatives.

     

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    Would you say that there exists a difference in the working environment of a law firm and legal department of the govt. offices?

    Most certainly, although I am not in a position to comment in depth on private law firms, as I have never worked in one. In the Government, everyone works for the Government of the day, and the work is not limited to legal issues. The tasks at hand are quite complex: they involve participating in drafting legislation, policy making, negotiating treaties and a variety of other roles. Most importantly, working for the Government means representing the Country and promoting collective rather than individual interests.

     

    What is the procedure to apply for an internship and recruitment at MEA? What are the qualities which they look for in their prospective employees?

    It starts with sending the completed form in the requisite format, along with references, to the Ministry to the Administrative Division (or any other Division that interests a prospective intern). From there, the applications are considered on merit. It is generally difficult to accommodate all applicants considering the huge volume of applications usually received. Details on applying for an internship at the MEA are enumerated on the website of the MEA.

     

    Have you ever considered starting up on your own?

    Starting my own practice has always been at the back of my mind. If I start my private chamber practice, I would focus on litigation before the Supreme Court, High Courts and Tribunals.  Considering my LL.M specialization and current work, I would be keen to pursue an active practice in investment arbitration, as well as international and domestic commercial arbitration.

    I firmly believe that there is potential everywhere, and it is about looking out through the window of opportunity. Talent finds its happiness in execution. Simply follow your heart, make the right choices and be dedicated.

     

    Please tell us about the requisite soft skills which are essential for a young lawyer to build a successful career?

    Communication skills, which are essential in any profession, are particularly valuable for a young lawyer. An open line of communication with colleagues assists in efficiency and securing solid relationships. Clarity, charisma and discretion must be kept in mind when dealing with clients.

    Commitment is important, given the heavy workload of young lawyers, and the established standards of excellence.

    Creativity is an immense asset, as innovation and thinking outside the box aid in problem solving and negotiation.

     

    What are your views on the future of Indian legal education? How would you suggest that a law student manages to stay ahead?

    I would like our institutions to compete with the best in the world. There is no dearth of resources in India, but we have to make optimal use of them. I hope to live to see the day our institutions are ranked among the best in the world, and pray that it is not far away. We need to support academicians in their pursuit. I personally am of the view that institutions should create a platform to bring in greater interaction between practitioners and students. The greatest asset of any educational institution is the character of its teachers. We need to encourage research and avoid spoon feeding. Classrooms should be about imparting knowledge and not forcing one’s views on the others. Students should be prepared to face the world outside beyond the realms of the microcosm of universities. I would suggest encouraging research and more practical classes and workshops. They are the need of the hour. The legal fraternity has to come together and support our institutions with a clear roadmap for the way ahead.

     

    What are the three things you consider law students should do in their careers?

    To me, goals should be set individually, and not based on what someone else has achieved. Be yourself, as they say. The markers of success vary, but generally, I would say that it can be achieved by staying focused, working smart and being organized. Professional mileage can be optimized with perseverance, perspiration and a stroke of luck.

     

    What would be your parting message to young lawyers?

    Here I would like to borrow from Mr. Fali Nariman, who lists the following in his autobiography “Before Memory Fades”:

    • A lawyer’s opinion should be honest and responsible,
    • A good lawyer should acquaint oneself with relevant law, including case law on the subject at hand,
    • One should be clear and precise, not confused,
    • One should keep oneself informed and up to date with all the reported judgments and decisions of the Supreme Court and High Courts,
    • A lawyer should be well prepared for his case.

    A lawyer must never stop learning, for intellect demands clarity and certainty. That said, circumstances render uncertainty inevitable and fascinating. In an ever changing world, progress is proportional to the capacity to endure uncertainty.

    One’s name is a prized possession in this mortal world, which through our acts, deeds and achievements can be immortalized and etched in the minds of generations to come.

     

  • Kirthi Srinivas, Associate, HSB Partners, on law school experience at ILS Pune and first year of graduation

    Kirthi Srinivas, Associate, HSB Partners, on law school experience at ILS Pune and first year of graduation

    Kirthi Srinivas holds a degree in B.SL, LL.B. from ILS Law College, Pune, he graduated in 2013. He has participated in various co-curricular activities and has multiple publications to his name. He was also the Convener of Corporate Law Cell at ILS which he had co-founded in his second year of law school and was also associated with ILS Law Journal. While in law school, he also managed to pursue Advanced Course in Copyright and Related Rights (DL – 201) from WIPO and Certificate Course in Competition Law & IPR from FICCI. Soon after graduation, he joined Indiabulls as a Management Trainee/Legal Office. Currently he works as an Associate at HSB Partners.

    In this interview, he talks about: –

    • His law school experience;
    • The importance of academics as well as co-curricular activities at law school; and
    • His experience at India Bulls and HSB Partners.

     

    Legal studies are still only a backup option for quite a lot of students. What motivated you to choose law as a career? How did you get through to ILS Law College, Pune?

    That is a correct understanding of the psyche,as a lot of students in India end up choosing technical/science or commerce stream after Grade 12primarily because of the career avenues it opens up.However, the trend is changing as a lot more students in India now understand that a legal degree offers anequally wide array of career options beyond court rooms.They recognize that the skills you pick up during law school and during initial years of practicecentres around skills like people management and added to that a lawyer’s ability to communicate effectively helps and these are skills which are at the heart of management skills andthus opens up an array of career option in other fields. Therefore, I agree with the statement in a historical context however, I believe that a career in law is now fast emerging as the primary option for a lot of youngsters in India for the aforesaid reasons.

    In my case, I had taken up science stream after Grade 10, and since, I do not have any lawyers in my immediate family I wasn’t aware of what it means to have a career in the legal profession, but my drift from science stream to legal profession was initiated by my interactions with my cousin who had just graduated from law school at that point in time and had started practising indirect taxation with Lakhsmikumaran and Sridaran at Delhi.Hearing stories abouthis experiences at work were quite interesting and sparked my interest in the legal profession.After some further research on my own I realized that legal profession had a lot to offer than the traditional clichés it is known for. Application to ILS, happened as a conscious effort as I had heard about the college from a school senior and it seemed a good place to study law. Apart from that the college is located in Pune which is known to be a college town.

     

    How did you fare in your academics at ILS? Would you say a great CGPA is a necessity to kickstart a good career in the legal profession?

    I believe that I had a balanced academic career at ILS, spread between academics and other extra-curricular activities which included being part of the editorial committee of the college law review, taking part in moot courts and being the convenor of the corporate law cellwhich I co-founded during my second year at ILS. I believe that maintaining a decent percentage or CGPA is desirable, but anything below that is not an end of the world scenario. I think percentages apart, a fresher needs to have skills such as willingness to learn in order to kickstart a good career in law as most of what you learn at law school are very theoretical in nature and will be unlearnt to accommodate for practical learnings which cannot be taught at law school.

     

    Did you have any such experience during an internship which helped you decide your career choice?

    Since ILS has a more traditional approach to testing and evaluation of the students, there was no concept of chapter-wise tests or projects or compulsory presentations etc., therefore theemphasis were on the semester exams. We had a 3 week preparatory leave prior to the semester exams and that took care of the preparation for the semester exams. So, the emphasis was always to score well in the semester exams in order to maintain a healthy aggregate percentage. Apart from that, as an addition to regular classroom academics I had enrolled myself in certain diplomas/certificate programmes thathelped me a lot.

    All my internships were with law firms and with a tax portal which included Mulla&Mulla& Craigie Blunt &Caroe, Crawford Bayley & Co, ALMT Legal, Taxsutra and Juris Corp and revolved around general corporate, mergers and acquisition, banking andcompetition/anti-trust areas of practice. Certain assignments which I carried out during my internship helped me develop interest in my current areas of practice. I feel that each internship taught me something new, but I am biased towards my internship at Crawford Bayley and Juris Corp for certain assignments which I was part of and which I thoroughly enjoyed and revolved my current areas of practice.

     

    What all activities did you participate in?  How important do you think that extra-curricular activities are to a law student?

    I participated in moot courts actively in the first 4 years of college and later took up drafting moot problems/case studies.As my time at college progressed my interest gravitated towards organising events at college. In second year of college, I co-founded the corporate law cell, a cell whose aim was to have an informal discussion among the student body on the latest news in the world of corporate laws et al. Apart from the aforesaid, I have been part of the editorial board of the college law review.

    Answering the second part of your query, I feel extra-curricular activities were important in shaping me and believe were an integral part of my learning experience, I believe that there is no “one size fits all” concept when it comes to how a student goes about structuring their time at law school. Therefore, it is best left to the discretion of the students.

     

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    What were your areas of interest during your graduation? How did you go about developing expertise and knowledge in these areas?

    My initial interest in law school revolved around international law, contracts, constitutional law as these were the initial law subjects taught to us and were quite interesting. However, over the course of my interactions with certainseniors and exposure I received during internship,my interest shiftedtowards corporate laws especially investment laws, mergers and acquisition and competition law. Developing interest is easy but sustaining it is the tough part. Writing research papers, articles, presenting at conferences are some of the options I explored. I think reading about these subjects both from a legal and a commercial perspective also helped.

     

    After graduation, you joined Indiabulls as a Management Trainee /Officer – Legal. What had contributed towards this appointment? What did you take away from your experience at Indiabulls?

    I was always interested working in-house for a while, but was reserving such an assignment after spending my initial years after graduation with a firm. The move to Indiabulls, therefore was as a matter of coincidence and happened as part of the placements facilitated by the college. The assignment revolved around dealing with compliances of a mortgages company. Since, my experiences prior to Indiabulls had been in the form of internships at law firms exclusively, working in-house at Indiabulls was unique. However, when I reflect on what it has taught me I would have to say working in-house lends perspective now more than ever as I can relate to being on the other side and can relate better to a client and thus I am equipped to provide appropriate solutions.

     

    After having worked at Indiabulls for 8 months, how did the shift to HSB Partners take place? How did you go about bagging this job? Please tell us about the recruitment process atHSB Partners?

    I had always wanted to start my career at a firm and then shift to an in-house legal department, but the reverse was true in my case. Therefore, I was on the lookout for an opportunity and heard that the firm was on the lookout for a fresher with about 1 year PQE at that point in time, added to that I wanted to focus on my areas of interest and the firm is known for its transaction and advisory capabilities in venture capital/private equity, m&aetc. and the firm has a strong clientele in South India which prompted me to make the jump. The recruitment process is quite simple and hassle free, and the firm gets in touch with prospective candidatesbased on the applications received and sets up an interview with a partner, it comprised of two rounds of interview in my case (both of which were technical in nature).The interview is based on the resume and latest developments in corporate law/regulations.

     

    Please give our readers some tips to perform well at a law firm interview.

    I think a law firm interview at a fresher level is designed to test your basic understanding of law, commercial awareness and common sense. First and foremost tip is to keep your resume short and relevant to the kind of opportunity you are targeting, therefore if you are interested in being a transaction lawyer your resume should be tailored to your internship experience relevant to that in case if you are a fresher. Second, you are expected to be well versed with every little detail in your resume e.g. If you have carried out a research during a past internship and the same is listed in your resume, you are required to know the position of law with respect to the same both from its historical and current standpoint.

     

    How tough were the first six months at your workplace?What are your day-to-day responsibilities? How is the experience so far?

    I wouldn’t say my first six months at HSB were tough. It was interesting from the standpoint of the kind of work/assignment I was exposed to. Work at HSB, generally happens as a product of debate between team mates and senior colleagues are helpful in shaping the discussion towards a productive outcome. The day-to-day responsibilities revolves around tracking various stages in which assignments are and responding accordingly. It involves reviews of opinions/documents, drafting a suite of documents based on the kind of assignment we are engaged in, client meetings and strategies in relation to the aforesaid. So, far my experience has been good. I think most of it is contributed by the variety of work we do and the clients we interact with.

     

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    How do you keep yourself abreast with latest industry news and trends?

    I think it is very  important to stay well versed with the constant changes to laws/regulations in order to advice client’s effectively, so the obvious answer would be to proactively track certain government websites such as MCA, RBI, SEBI etc., apart from certain blogs to keep abreast with latest changes to policy etc. However, even if one does not proactively stays in sync with the latest updates, it happens as part of work when one has to read various policies/laws/regulations and changes to them while preparing opinions and drafting documentation.

     

    What are the primary professional ethics you follow while at work? What has been your strategy to deal with errors and mistakes?

    The thumb rule in professional ethics which all lawyers follow is to keep our client’s work confidential. As a young lawyer, I have had my fair share of doubts but my strategy has always been “when in doubt consult your senior”. In my view, it is a better option to minimise errors/mistakes by holding back on the work/responding in haste especially if you are unsure or have a persisting doubt thus you can avoid a faulty decision from translating into an error/mistake.

     

    Does HSB Partners take interns? What do you feel makes an intern stand out and is very important for him to do to have a chance of getting a call back or even a PPO?

    HSB takes interns throughout the year. Interested applicant’s are required to send a short e-mail with their desired period of internship and attaching their resume, the relevant team in-charges subsequently get back on the availability of a slot for an internship. In general, if an intern has an open mind and willingness to learn coupled with the ability to work intelligently then their chances of getting a call back/ PPO increases dramatically.

     

    The question that whether one should specialise in a particular area of law or be more of a general lawyer often comes up before law students. What is your opinion on the same?

    I think there are no generalist in law, there are several lawyers who tend to advise on variety of subjects but they too have their specialities through which they are recognized. Being a super specialist right from the start is not advisable because it is very difficult for a lawyer to be sure of their interest right from Day 1 of practice, as the profession is quite dynamic in nature and the scope of work keeps changing, in course of time it would be highly likely that everyone dabbles with multiple practice areas, therefore it would rather be desirable to have a handful of linked subjects/ areas of practice which one has interest towards and see what interests you better in the longer run and focus on those.

     

    Many lawyers would say that the actual learning takes place in the years of practice. How far would you say it is true? What was the case in your situation?

    I think that is very true. Most of what one learns at law school is oriented towards theory and is vital in laying a strong foundation towards principles that make up the subject. However, law as a subject is constantly evolving therefore it is in a state of constant flux and by that token a lawyer needs to constantly unlearn and learn new things to be able to stay relevant.

     

    Lastly, what would be your parting message for our readers?

    For freshers specially and those who are thinking of taking up legal profession, the profession as such is slow in terms of growth as compared to investment banking, finance etc., so you will be required to have patience in order to succeed. Second, the other key principle to success in this profession is to work intelligently as opposed to working hard. Thus, it would be wiser to develop the proficiency in order to work faster to deliver with better/faster turn arounds for your clients without compromising on the quality of deliverables.

     

  • Varun Pathak, Manager, DSK Legal, on Law School experience at GGSIU & LSE, and varied work experience at Law firms and Litigation

    Varun Pathak, Manager, DSK Legal, on Law School experience at GGSIU & LSE, and varied work experience at Law firms and Litigation

    Varun Pathak graduated from Guru Gobind Singh Indraprastha University in 2007. Thereafter he went to pursue Masters in Corporate Commercial Laws from London School of Economics and Political Science. Soon after returning to India, he joined Krishnamurthy & Co. as an Associate and later switched to the office of Amarjit Singh Chandhiok. He has also worked at Paras Kuhad and Associates as an Associate before joining DSK Legal as a Senior Associate in March 2011. Currently he works as a Manager there.

    In this interview he talks about

    • Law school experience at GGSIU and LSE
    • Work experience in litigation and law firm
    • Journey from Senior Associate to Manager at DSK

     

    Could you please introduce yourself, professionally and academically, to our readers, who are mostly law students and young lawyers?

    I am a Litigator and am happy to be one. I started off being a corporate lawyer but soon realised that my heart lay elsewhere. I loved the hustle and bustle of litigation which I had experienced during my internships. The thrill of arguing in courts regularly is what drives me every day and I love what I am doing. I am presently retained by DSK Legal, Delhi. The majority of work that I am presently handling deals with regulatory and court matters in the infrastructure sector, commercial contractual disputes, arbitration and some constitutional matters.

    I read law at Amity Law School, GGSIPU and thereafter completed my Master of Laws from London School of Economics and Political Science. Academically I have been a merit student and had a 2:1 grade both in my undergrad and graduate degree. I have participated in my share of moot courts, sports and other extra-curricular activities in my student career. They are all important but the most important aspect, which I realised after starting practice, was the importance of reading law regularly. There is no replacement for hard work. Other than legal reading one should also read material from other areas, whatever stimulates one’s brain. A good reading portfolio is an advantage to any aspiring lawyer. Developing reading skills is one of the most (if not the most) important attribute for a Litigator.

     

    What motivated you to gravitate towards law, as a discipline and a career? Tell us about your induction in GGSIU?

    My foray into the legal field was actually a combination of some serendipitous circumstances and some deductive reasoning. I was very clear in my mind what I did not want to do. So I eliminated what I did not want to do and then narrowed down my choices to a few fields which I thought I would enjoy. So law was one of the options that I foresaw along with a few other career options and as destiny would have it, the cogs feel in place and I joined Amity Law School, GGSIPU. I wanted to be in Delhi so GGSIPU was an obvious choice and arguably Amity Law School was the better institute amongst the constituents and therefore, I chose Amity Law School.

     

    How was your experience during your five years at GGSIU?

    My time at Amity Law School was a learning experience. Most of my class mates were very competent and there was a sense of positive competition which was very inspiring. Actually we were the fourth batch and had good seniors who used to guide and mentor us regularly. Most of my seniors and batch mates are doing well for themselves and are making a name in the profession. One of the most important experiences in my five years was the sense of camaraderie with my colleagues and batch mates which we all have carried into our professional careers.

     

    Soon after completing graduation, you went to pursue Masters in Corporate Commercial Laws from London School of Economics and Political Science. How did you decide to go for higher studies?

    Many of our seniors had pursued masters abroad, so their experiences were definitely a factor. I decided to pursue my masters because I wanted global academic exposure and wanted to interact and learn new approaches to dealing with complex issues. My participation in the Stetson International Moot Court at Florida had given me a flavour of the western approach so I decided to enhance my skills by pursuing masters at LSE.

     

    What should one do differently in college if he wants to pursue higher studies after graduation? Would you suggest having a brief work experience before applying for LL.M?

    In hindsight I would say that there are many things which can be done to improve your chances of pursuing masters at a premier institute. Firstly, one should start preparing for the application from the first year itself by building a varied repertoire of skills. Mooting and internships definitely help however, it is important to be focussed in your approach and it is better to apply to a handful of institutes after narrowing down your areas of interest than making frantic mass applications at the end of the fourth year. Further, please choose the professors of your intended course and do some research before you make that final application.

    With respect to prior work experience it is actually a personal decision for the individual concerned. Some institutes prefer work experience and definitely some work experience will provide you with some good perspective. However, I wanted to be done with my studies before I started practice so went for my masters immediately after my LLB.

     

    Please tell us about your time at LSE. Please share with our readers, the details about the academic pressure, faculty and campus life.

    LSE was a very good experience. The approach to academics was very different than what we are brought up on. The focus is on analysis and individual application of mind and reasoning. The faculty was some of the best in the world and professors were international authorities in their respective fields. My course in corporate commercial law was one of the best in the world. It was a very intense course with a lot of reading material. Being from a common law country it was not very difficult to adapt to the UK education system however, there were many things that I had to unlearn which I had picked up in our education system.

    My time at LSE was fun and I was part of the students’ body for our LL.M class. I also represented LSE in Willem C. Vis Arbitration Moot at Vienna. In fact, I also used to write for one of the students’ newspaper at LSE.

    All in all LSE was a great experience and taught me many things about myself.It helped me grow both as an individual and also as lawyer.

     

    What kind of responsibilities you were entrusted with at your workplaces after coming to India? How did you prefer litigation over law firm?

    (After coming back to India, Varun joined Krishnamurthy & Co as an Associate and later switched to Offices of Amarjit Singh Chandhiok as a Junior Associate.)

    I joined Klaw’s Mumbai office and started my practice under the watchful guidance of Naina Krishnamurthy and Shwetambari Rao. Both of them were great leaders in their own light and taught me a lot. However, my true love was litigation and therefore, I moved back to Delhi and started with Mr. Amarjit Singh Chandhiok. Mr. Chandhiok is an institution in himself and at his office I learnt my basics which haveheld me in good stead till date.

    At Klaw, I was reporting to Naina directly. Naina was the Managing Partner. The Mumbai office had just been started so I was responsible for dealing with clients and execution of work under Naina’s and Shweta’s guidance.

    At Mr. Chandhiok’s office I was responsible for assisting him in arguing briefs, preparation of notes, research, et cetera.

    Both the roles were completely different. At Klaw I was a corporate attorney whereas with Mr. Chandhiok I was a Junior Counsel. Since Mr. Chandhiok was a designated Senior Counsel and subsequently Additional Solicitor General of India my job was to assist him in arguing matters in the Court.

     

    Later you switched to Paras Kuhad & Associates, Advocates and worked there as an Associate for one year. What led to this shift?

    Paras Kuhad & Associates was where I started working as an Associate in a litigation team. I was reporting to Mr. Ravi Prakash there. I moved to DSK Legal along with Mr. Ravi Prakash in 2011.

    The overall experience was good and under Mr. Prakash’s guidance I started handling matters independently and started arguing regularly in various forums.

     

    Thereafter you joined DSK Legal as a Senior Associate and currently work as a Manager there? How did your appointment take place? How did the promotion happen?

    I had moved with Mr. Prakash in 2011 to DSK Legal. I have been with DSK Legal for more than four years and with Mr. Prakash for more than five years. I have grown as a lawyer and am happy where I am at currently. The designation of Manager was more a consequence than anything else. It was recognition of the fact that I was handling matters independently.

     

    What does a Manager at a Law Firm like DSK Legal do? What falls within the scope of your responsibility? Tell us about a typical work day.

    The role and responsibility of a Manager is to handle matters independently and assist the Partner whenever required. The role also involves some amount of mentoring and supervising the work of senior associates and associates.

    My typical work day involves going to Court and arguing a matter, meeting clients, drafting, reviewing the work of my juniors and sometimes briefing senior counsels.

     

    What is the most challenging or stressful part of being a Manager at one of the most successful law firms in the country?

    The stressful part is management part where administratively things have to be taken care off. However, in a firm structure certain things are necessary and have to be followed.

    As a Litigator one has to work very hard because the gestation period is longer. I enjoy what I do and am able to make time for the things that are necessary and important.

     

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    What kind of effort should a young associate put in to work to get it appreciated?

    For me the willingness to work hard is very important.

     

    How important would you say are business development skills at such higher roles in a corporate law firm?

    Business development skills are obviously important. We are a service industry and therefore, client satisfaction is of paramount importance. Business development is a necessary evil, one which must be nurtured and developed for continued existence.

     

    What do you feel makes an intern stand out and is very important for him to do to have a chance of getting a call back or even a PPO?

    Interns should try and shoulder more responsibility and try and execute assignments in the same manner like an Associate. Hard work and perseverance definitely get noticed.

     

    Do you feel that higher education helps a person to have a successful legal career?

    Higher studies provide you with a good perspective. It may or may not result in a successful career. That depends on your drive and motivation. My advice would be that study only if you want to and not because everyone else if doing it. The same is applicable with anything else.

     

    What would be your message to our readers who are budding lawyers and law students?

    Work hard and remember that genius is 1% inspiration and 99% perspiration. There is no substitute for hard work. Tiredness is only a state of mind.

    Also please read the bare provisions of the relevant law every single time you work on a matter. Please apply yourself independently and do not follow people blindly, even if that person is your superior. After all the right to make a mistake and be stupid is everyone’s prerogative and Article 14 applies there as well.

  • Sanjeevi Shanthakumar, Dean, Faculty of Law, SGT University, on establishing three elite law schools, teaching and academics

    Sanjeevi Shanthakumar, Dean, Faculty of Law, SGT University, on establishing three elite law schools, teaching and academics

    Prof. Sanjeevi Shanthakumar is a graduate from Dr. Ambedkar Government Law College, Chennai (Madras University) (Batch of 1989). Thereafter he pursued LL.M. from Madras University with specialization in International Law and Constitutional Law.

    Currently he is Dean, Faculty of Law at SGT University, Gurgaon [NCR]. Earlier, he was Director of ITM Law School, ITM University, Gurgaon, Director of MATS Law School, MATS University, Raipur; Controller of Examinations of Hidayatullah National Law University, Raipur; Associate Professor of Law at Hidayatullah National Law University, Raipur; Senior Lecturer at Government, Law College, Madurai; Senior Lecturer at Government Law College, Chennai. Before joining the legal academia he had practiced at the Madras High Court for seven years as legal practitioner.

    He has an unique experience of establishing three elite law schools on a self financing mode.

    He shares his experiences in this interview.

     

    Please tell us a bit about your pre-college years, you as a student, your ambitions as a child. Did you have lawyers in your family or among close relatives?

    During my school days, I was a studious and enterprising child. Believed in honesty and hard work. Very cooperative and helpful to teachers and the school administration. One day when my class teacher was asking about the subjects we like the most, each student was naming either maths or science. When my turn came, I stood up and said “civics” and all the students in the class laughed at me. I never knew those days that this interest in civics will lead me to study law. I never had any lawyer in the family or amongst my relatives. Hence, was complexly unaware of legal profession.

     

    What were your objectives when you thought about law while still in the preliminary years of Law College? What were your goals after graduating? What were the options available to you?

    As I said, I never knew about this profession. My father wanted me to be a Medical Practitioner. Since I could not get a seat in the Medical College, I got admitted in B.Sc. [Chemistry] and started attending classes. One day, my dad came to my college and said that we need to go to the Madras law college and the interview is scheduled for admission to five year integrated law degree program. I walked with him without realizing that this is going to be a turning point in my life. Went to the Law College, faced the interview and later was declared selected. That was the starting point of my law journey.

    At the law college things were much unorganized. Was very scared to study in that environment. Was feeling very sad and was repenting my decision of joining the law college. Fortunately got few friends who cajoled me. Started developing interest in studies after meeting a friend called Gnanasekar. He was too elderly to be called a friend and hence we used to call him as “uncle”. He was the one who motivated me to study law. He used to call us outside the class room and started explaining to us each and every topic. He never used to carry text books like any other student. He used to carry with him volumes of AIR and read to us the full judgments of the Supreme Court. This created interest in me to read law through cases and law as interpreted by the Courts. He got opportunity to work on a part-time basis at a very popular law firm in Chennai, our interaction with him got reduced and I assumed his role in teaching my friends. This is how; I started teaching though informally.

    Instant recognition and appreciations after a good lecture fascinated me and forced me to take up teaching. Those were the days when there was a serious dearth of good law teachers. I went for a coaching class for preparing for the Civil Services Examination. The Teacher who was teaching Indian Polity could not come to classes regularly due to certain personal reasons. One day I tried to fill the gap by teaching a topic in Indian Polity. The overwhelming appreciation and feedback from my fellow students gave me confidence to become a good teacher. Based on the feedback from student the Director of the Centre Prof. M.F. Khan insisted that I should teach Indian Polity regularly and I got in to active teaching.

    My practice at the Madras High Court was a great experience. I was with one of the top ranking law firms M/s. Aiyar & Dolia and had a roaring practice. Received appreciations from my seniors, colleagues, clients and judges. In spite of these, my passion was in teaching and hence went for a full time Masters Degree Program at Madras University with specialization in International Law and Constitutional Law. After my Masters I cleared the UGC JRF and got the Junior Research Fellowship to do PhD in Law wherein as part of the fellowship terms and conditions, I had to deliver lectures for LL.M. students. Teaching Post Graduate Law students started this way and later got appointed as Senior Lecturer at the Government Law College, Chennai, and I happily started to teach at the college where I studied law. Later, on official transfer went to Government Law College, Madurai from where I resigned and joined Hidayatullah National Law University, Raipur. After HNLU, went to establish a new Law School for MATS University at Raipur as its founder Director, later established ITM Law School at ITM University, Gurgaon as its founder Director and now establishing the Faculty of Law at SGT University, Gurgaon as its founder Dean.

     

    Which subject do you enjoy teaching the most?

    (Sanjeevy has taught a number of both traditional legal subjects and the trending ones from Jurisprudence to Constitutional Law to International Law.)

    Not only the above mentioned conventional law subjects. I have the experience of designing curricula for Honours Courses wherein I had taught courses like “Biotechnology and Law”, “National Regulation of International Trade”, Science Technology and Law, etc. However, I enjoyed teaching Environmental Law the most and other subjects like International Law and Constitutional Law. I would also love to teach and enjoy teaching Environmental Law.

     

    Tell us about your teaching methodology. Do you encourage students to take notes or do you engage your students in active class participation? What advice do you share with your students on scoring higher grades?

    My teaching was never a one way process. I was one of the fortunate few teachers to get trained to teach under a World Bank Capacity Building Project and also at Cardiff University, U.K. under the British Council Funded Project. Whatever new teaching methods I learnt at these programs, I disseminated the same to many other young law teachers, through various training programs for law teachers on law teaching methods, at different universities across the county.

    I focus more on active learning rather than on teaching. It was always student centric. I actively involve the students in the process of learning the subject. During a semester, I deliver very few lectures. Most of the topics used to be learnt through small group discussions, role plays, field visits, seminars and projects. My question papers to assess my students understanding were always unique and different. Questions will never test their memory. Instead, it will encourage them to apply the acquired knowledge over a given situation and to come out with unique solutions, both legal and non-legal.

    I encouraged students in small groups to visit environmentally affected areas and to talk to various stakeholders to find out the real reasons for the problem and approach the administrators to find out what measures have been taken and finally to come out with their original solutions to resolve the problem. These methods helped every student to get engaged in the learning process. I made certain passionate students’ members of a Public Trust founded by me and named as “TREES” Trust for Research and Education on Environment and Sustainable Development” through which they continue to do some good work for the cause of environment, thereby engaging them in a life long learning process.

    My teaching methods for teaching Environmental Law was recently recognized by the Asian Development Bank, Manila by conferring on me the “Environmental Law Champions Development Award”.

     

    What role do legal researchers and academics play in the Indian legal system? What positive changes would you recommend on this aspect of the legal system?

    I personally feel by the legal academics have a greater role in producing quality legal professionals. As it was rightly said, the “Quality of the Bar determines the Quality of Justice”. Hence, it is the primary responsibility of legal academic to ensure the quality of the bar though developing the quality of law students who enter the bar.

    The only change I would recommend to all my law teaching fraternity is that, ‘Please take law teaching seriously and don’t take law teaching for granted. Do justice to your profession; else the nation will fail as a consequence of chain reaction.

     

    When would you say that an academician is successful? What are the career goals legal academicians should set for themselves?

    A Legal Academician’s success is measured in terms of the quality of legal professionals he produces. I feel successful, when I hear news about the success stories of my students, whom I have taught at different points of time. I could not avoid but sharing this news that this year four of my students got admitted to the LLM Degree Program at Harvard Law School. This gives me, as an academic to feel successful.

    The one point career goal for any legal academic is to be a good teacher and to be recognized as such. All the other positions and opportunities will automatically follow as and when time progress.

    Most of the opportunities I have had so far came to me through the recommendations of my students. One of my students even recommended to her peers and teachers at Oxford University to invite me to give a talk on Environmental Law at Oxford, which I did.  My students believed that I can do and I try not to disappoint them.

     

    You have authored several books and have written various research papers. How did you find time to write so many scholarly articles?

    For writing books, you need to have a compelling reason. I wrote books on Environmental Law only to help my students, as they were suffering for want of good reading materials, at that point of time, when Universities started to teach Environmental Law as a compulsory course. I tried to help them again with the help of a group of students, who dedicated a lot of time and energy to collect all the information and data required to author a book.

     

    What was the biggest challenge that you had to face while building the law schools?

    (Sanjeevy is the founder Director of MATS Law School as well as of ITM Law School, Gurgaon)

    The biggest challenge was to attract good students because without good students around me, I will not be able to experiment or innovate in legal education.

     

    Any thoughts on the current system in place to train the Indian judiciary and continuous legal education of lawyers? How can these systems be improved and made more effective?

    I believe in the importance of “Continuous Legal Education” for lawyers and judges especially in the trial courts. 15 years back, I conducted one “CLE Program for Young Lawyers”, while I was teaching at the Government Law College, Chennai. I received tremendous response for the same and appreciations for the initiative. I wanted it to be a regular feature. Due to transfers and relocation, I could not continue the CLEP. As Dean of SGT University Faculty of Law, I have started doing it again, and hope to continue it.

     

    As the current Dean of Faculty of Law, SGT University, how do you feel SGT can take a greater role in social engineering in India?

    As Dean of the Faculty of Law of SGT University I try to leave no stone unturned to make the law school a clinical law school where students learn through experience. I believe in “justice education” in contrast to “legal education”. I am trying to provide my students, maximum exposure to the legal profession through various clinical activities.

    I constantly remind them to think critically and not to accept anything just because it is there. To help the students feel more socially responsible I facilitate their visits to the communities for interaction very frequently through the legal literacy club. These visits to the communities and interaction with legal luminaries gives them a complete picture of the working of the Indian Legal System. Since they are made to personally feel the pain and sufferings of individuals, I sincerely believe that they will do their level best to mitigate pain and ensure justice.

     

    How do you say a student can manage to stay ahead of the ‘rat race’?

    Today, I find students quite impatient. My only advice to the young law students is that, keep working, work with dedication, sincerely and honestly maintaining the integrity and dignity of the legal profession. Results will follow as a natural consequence. Remember the phrase that “Rome was not built in a day”.

     

    What would be your message to those hard working law students who did not make it to a top NLU but want to excel in the profession?

    Many of those who are on top of the legal profession today were never a student of an NLU. In fact the NLUs started existing in public knowledge only 5-10 years ago. If they can do, why not you?

  • Abhilasha Nautiyal, Senior Associate, IPR and Competition Law, Anand & Anand, on LL.M from Harvard and job experience

    Abhilasha Nautiyal, Senior Associate, IPR and Competition Law, Anand & Anand, on LL.M from Harvard and job experience

    Abhilasha Nautiyal graduated from Army Institute of Law, Mohali in 2010. While in law school, during her internship at Anand and Anand, she was offered a job which she accepted and started working there after graduation. Thereafter she went to pursue Masters from Harvard Law School. After coming back to India, she again joined Anand and Anand but this time as a Senior Associate. Currently she practices IP and Competition Law at Anand and Anand.

    In this interview, she talks about:

    • Law school experience at AIL
    • LL.M from Harvard
    • Career in Intellectual Property law
    • Work at Anand and Anand

     

    Tell us about your profile and how did you decide to study law?

    I work with Anand and Anand and practice IP and competition law.

    Law was a fortuitous choice, and going to AIL was also a matter of chance – I was preparing for med school when a friend introduced me to the idea of going to law school. Being from an army background, Army Institute of Law seemed like a law school I could realistically get into.

     

    What has been your experience on the NLU and Non-NLU divide?

    Yes, there is some truth in that. Luckily for me, I interned and now work at a firm that doesn’t differentiate amongst its resources on an NLU/Non-NLU divide.

     

    After graduating from AIL, you joined Anand and Anand as an Associate. How did the appointment take place?

    I was offered a job at Anand and Anand during an internship. As an associate, I assisted senior members of the litigation team. The learning curve of a litigating lawyer is steep and there is of course a lot to catch up with in terms of what the law is and how the legal machinery actually functions as opposed to what one thinks of the legal system in law school.

     

    How would you describe your experience while studying Masters from Harvard Law School?

    I always wanted to have a more fulfilling academic experience, hence an LL.M. I have come across people in the profession who feel that an LL.M. has very limited value for a litigating lawyer. In my experience, the LL.M. year opened my mind to diverse ideas, which I believe is a great ‘value addition’ for a lawyer irrespective of the field of law he or she is practicing. The LL.M. year is not just about academics but is a great opportunity for personal growth.

     

    After coming back from Harvard you were offered the position of a Senior Associate at Anand and Anand. How would you say the LL.M affected your career?

    There are several factors involved in the process – time at the firm and ability to handle individual responsibility are examples of criteria the firm may look at. I was directly offered the rank of Senior Associate after my LL.M from Harvard.

    An LL.M., at the very least, does refine ones thinking, which is a great boost. My responsibilities at Anand and Anand have increased over the years. One must bear in mind that foreign education comes at the price and must be prepared to make such an investment.

     

    Tell us a bit about work culture at Anand and Anand and the life of a Senior Associate.

    I am happy to be working with people who are as passionate, if not more, about the law. We enjoy our work and team work is our strength. I handle matters in consultation with the partners. My responsibilities include handling day to day requirements of clients, advisory work, appearances in court and taking forward the competition law practice of the firm.

     

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    How did you build up your expertise in IPR? Tell us about your work experience.

    I learnt a lot during internships and on the job. Like I said before, there is a huge gap between what we study in law school and how we actually practice law. It is important to bridge that gap – a headstart in college by focusing on quality internships is very important. The role of an IP lawyer may involve several facets like transactional work, consultancy, prosecution or litigation. The key is to do your job and to do it well. Attention to detail is a quality that can help one go a long way in this profession.

    I most enjoy working on matters at the cusp of IP and competition law. This includes FRAND and compulsory licensing problems. At the risk of sounding clichéd, I feel there is no substitute for hard work (and good strategy!)

    If you are passionate about IP, life will be much simpler as an IP lawyer.

    Mistakes happen – it’s fine as long as you learn and move on. As I have learnt over the years, it important to try because most mistakes can be corrected.

     

    How are internships helpful for a law student? What are the other options available for someone interested in IP?

    Internships are a must. Diligence is well appreciated during internships.

    It’s always helpful to have an idea of the relevant substantive and procedural law. General awareness of burning issues in your field of interest will help.

    Working with start ups, or having your own legal start up, may be a lucrative option in some cases. Alternatively, teaching, clerking with courts, or working for a government agency are other options to explore.

     

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    How do you maintain your work-life balance?

    This is a tough one. My husband is also a lawyer so both of us work long hours. The trick is to take benefit of any break, long or short, that comes our way.

  • Sindhu Shankar, Legal Counsel, Infosys, on law school experience at NLU Jodhpur and on work experience

    Sindhu Shankar, Legal Counsel, Infosys, on law school experience at NLU Jodhpur and on work experience

    Sindhu Shankar is a graduate from National Law University, Jodhpur (Batch of 2011). Thereafter she worked with Corporate advisory and Technology practice group of Poovayya & Co., Advocates & Solicitors for two years. Later, she switched to Infosys Ltd. as a Senior Associate Legal Counsel. Recently, she has been promoted to Legal Counsel there.

    In this interview she talks about:

    • Law school experience at NLUJ
    • Work experience at Poovayya & Co.
    • Work and internship procedure at Infosys

    How would you introduce yourself? Could you please share a little bit of what motivated you to pursue law as a career?

    I am an in-house legal counsel with an interest in new technology and related laws and policy. I am currently a Legal Counsel with Infosys Limited, and work with the team advising the Australia and New Zealand part of the company. I was previously with the corporate team of Poovayya & Co., and was part of the firm’s technology practice group. I am an alumnus of National Law University, Jodhpur.

    I harboured a love for literature, excelled at debating in school, and had an aptitude for reasoning and current affairs. Given these interests I was propelled in the general direction of law school.It was only much later that I discovered that law could be applied to my other passions like technology and innovation. The prospects of working on the challenges of new technology over the coming years and the developing legal landscape in the Asia-Pacific region motivated me to pursue a career in this field, with a focus on this region.

    Tell us about your college life at NLUJ. What all activities did you partake in? Please tell us about the manner in which you approached academics while in college.

    I really enjoyed laws relating to technology and innovation, and this served as the focus point from which I perceived other areas of law.I undertook a variety of interesting internships (including a criminal law and sessions court internship experience, the employment team of a public sector undertaking, corporate teams of law firms and my internship with Poovayya& Co.). I also participated and excelled in co-curricular activities relating to public international law. I was also involved in mooting, MUNs, debates, client counselling, and the works. My involvement in the Cultural Committee and the Committee for Protection of Environment largely contributed to my time at National Law University, Jodhpur. Heading various activities of the committees and setting the stage for the first edition of the NH65 cultural fest was very fulfilling and an important part of my college experience.

    What I cherish the most about having attended National Law University, Jodhpur is the sheer variety of opportunities that the college facilitated for us students. Being able to try different activities and explore different aspects of the law helped me learn from each of them, and figure out what I wanted to do (and more importantly, what I did not want to pursue).If law school is all about figuring out what you want to do, and finding a way to do it, I would say it worked out pretty well for me.

    What were your areas of interest during your graduation? How did you go about developing expertise and knowledge in these areas?

    I was drawn to public international law and diplomacy during my graduating year, but did not actively pursue mooting or MUNs in my first two years at law school. In fact I began mooting entirely by chance, and only because a speaker on an international moot team dropped out in the very last minute, and the spot was thrown open to the person topped a written test on public international law. My co-speaker on the team was a seasoned speaker, and with his guidance I started mooting. Preparing for international moot court competitions helped develop my interest in and knowledge of public international law. Health law, which was introduced as an experimental course for my batch, also caught my fancy and I would follow developments in legal aspects of health innovation. Participating in the WIPO panel at the Harvard Model United Nations in my final year, was a culmination of my two interests during graduation – health and technology laws, and public international law.

    I continue to be interested in public international law at an academic level, and judge moot court competitions including the India national rounds of Jessup, the GNLU International Moot Court Competition, and the Surana&Surana National Corporate Law Moot court competition.

    Did you find that your law school education had prepared you sufficiently for the many tasks you were required to execute during your internships and later at your job?

    My law school education equipped me with the ability to find anything I want to find as long as it exists, the ability to learn new things and apply them in a logical manner, and the ability to process a lot of information in a short amount of time and convey it in a simpler manner. I believe these skills were vital for the tasks I was required to execute during my internship and remain very relevant in my current role.

    Soon after graduation, you joined Poovayya& Co., Advocates & Solicitors as an Associate. How did your appointment take place? What worked for you in securing the job?

    I sought an internship with Poovayya&Co., in my final year, with an intent to work with their technology law practice group. During my internship, I found myself thoroughly enjoying the varied nature of work I was handling – from litigation relating to use of new technology to compliance advisory on innovative ideas, for all sorts of clients from multinational companies to baby start-ups. My one month internship was extended, and my internship culminated in a pre-placement with the firm. On graduating I joined the technology practice group of Poovayya& Co., at Bangalore.  I believe my prior interest in and awareness of new technology, appetite for related work and performance during the internship helped me achieving my goal in working for the firm, and the practice group within the firm.

    Generally the first year after graduation is the most defining time of a fresh law graduate. What would you suggest a fresh law graduate should do to hold spirit and utilise the opportunities available?

    If one has not already figured out what one wants to do during law school, the first year after graduation is the best time to cast your fortunes with the opportunity which appeals to you the most, and figure out whether you want to pursue it. While a good salary package is important, most fresh law graduates fail to account for the ‘opportunity factor’ of working in certain roles at certain organisations, which are otherwise less lucrative to start off with. I would suggest that fresh law graduates focus on the experience and learning they are going to gain in the first few years than give importance to the possible signing bonus that lands in their laps. Try everything, you never know what you might like or you might experience.

    You left Poovayya to join Infosys as Senior Associate Legal Counsel in 2013. What prompted you to make this choice and what made this shift possible?

    The chance to work with Infosys presented itself at an opportune time when it made sense for me to gain more hands-on experience in the areas of my interest, and start specializing in a particular area of technology laws. While working at Poovayya& Co. was a fabulous experience in terms of the variety of projects I got to work on and see through, and my learnings from the team I was working with, a role with an in-house team where I would have to look at law through the lens of business and risk profiles, presented a new set of challenges. It certainly helped that the Infosys legal team functions a lot like a firm, and has an established and good reputation in the IT business. It also helped that my mentors at Poovayya& Co. supported my decision to move to Infosys in light of my career interests, and encouraged me to explore the opportunity which was presenting itself.

    Recently, you’ve been promoted to Legal Counsel at Infosys. How did you go about achieving this?

    I work with the team advising the Australia and New Zealand part of the company. I believe working as a part of a close-knit team, working closely with senior team members who are stalwarts in their areas of specialization, and the learning opportunities that working with my senior colleagues have provided me with have furthered my personal and professional development. I also appreciate that at Infosys, I have the flexibility to work on my other areas of interest such as intellectual property and data privacy, and take on projects which interest me.

    We would love to hear about your work profile. What is a normal workday like? Being the Legal Counsel, what are your responsibilities?

    A normal work day would involve drafting/reviewing, negotiating and advising on all kinds of commercial contracts for Infosys’ business in the Australia and New Zealand geography. This would include working with my colleagues who handle other jurisdictions or advise other Infosys group companies, colleagues from other internal teams and business functions on various issues, and front-ending with Infosys’ clients on our transactions. Occasionally, I would also work with internal stakeholders on non-contractual commercial issues such as intellectual property, data privacy or internal policy rollouts. I also oversee the functioning of the Infosys Legal team’s internship program.

    What were the biggest hurdles and challenges in the first few months? How did you deal with them?

    Moving from a law firm to an in-house team, my biggest challenge was in understanding the business of the company and the industry as a whole. Working for a singlepoint client(Infosys) and multiple internal clients also meant there was a lot of history behind the strategy of the company, and that I had to update myself rather quickly on my understanding of the business. Talking to my colleagues and hands-on training on the job helped me deal with the challenges and familiarize myself with the circumstances of my role. The challenges of advising business in a geography I was not familiar with, and working with experienced colleagues in the region has been a massive academic, professional and cultural learning experience for me.

    What are the primary essentials of a corporate lawyer? How do you say a fresh graduate can work on building these skills?

    The essential skills of a corporate lawyer are the ability to acquire knowledge, the ability to act on the knowledge and communicate the same, maintaining a professional network and acting in a professional and ethical manner at all times. The first two are a matter of passion for the field, and a good understanding of the subject matter at hand. A professional network is a matter of time, and professional integrity, as C.S. Lewis puts it, is a matter of ‘doing the right thing even when nobody is looking.’

    What are the primary professional ethics you follow while at work? How do you deal with mistakes or errors?

    Infosys is powered by values based on client value, leadership by example, integrity and transparency, fairness, and excellence. My personal and professional ethics align with that of the company.

    Mistakes and errors are inevitable. I believe that as long as you own up to your mistake, alert those who need to be alerted and bring a solution to the table along with the problem, you can redeem yourself to some extent.

    What is the procedure to apply for an internship at Infosys? What should one do and how to contact them to apply for an internship? What are the qualities which they look for in one and his/her CV?

    The Infosys Legal Internship (ILI) program was initiated approximately ten years ago with the intention of enriching the law student community and bridging the gap between law colleges and corporate legal departments. In this process, the ILI program has reached out to more than 1000 candidates and shortlisted approximately 50 interns over this period.

    We at Infosys Legal are very keen to recognize budding talent and nurture such talent. However, we also are particular that any applications coming through should display uniqueness and a sense of individuality. We wish to remove commonly held myths that brand names and bulk internships or moot courts are the path to securing internships in big corporate legal teams. Our focus is to select those interns who have a passion for the law and using this passion wish to carve their own space in the legal fraternity. The ILI program offers our interns the opportunity to work with our legal functions across our group companies, on a variety of assignments

    Our internship process is relatively simple. Interested candidates may send their CVs to abhijit_poonja@edgeverve.com and sindhu_shankar01@infosys.com. Abhijit and I manage the India ILI program for the Infosys group. From the CVs received and on their respective merits we shortlist candidates for interviews. The shortlisted candidates are then interviewed by us, and this interview determines whether Infosys shall extend a time bound internship offer to the selected candidate. We usually entertain applications only 2-3 months before the candidate’s proposed internship period and as a process we usually select only 1-2 interns each month.

    What are the basic subjects which one should read and have understanding of before sitting for an interview?

    I would suggest gaining a good understanding of how the legal team of each company works, and figuring out where one fits in, in the team. In a vast ocean of opportunities, it helps to be in a role which fits you personally, aligns with your goals, and from where you are able to contribute to the team most effectively. The legal team at Infosys has lawyers with varied career paths and specializations. A few things I find are common characteristics among the people I work with at Infosys are the ability to learn, the ability to adapt with new learning, being a team player, and a strong work ethic.

    Is there any other tip you would like to give to our budding professionals?

    Internships provide an excellent opportunity to experience what it is like to work with different kinds of teams and clients, in different areas of law. I would suggest that law students explore the avenues available to them through internships, before beginning to specialize in a certain kind of legal practice. For budding professionals, it does good to know what you do not want to do, before figuring out and passionately pursuing what you want to do!