Can you walk us through your journey in the legal profession, from your early days to your current position as General Counsel for Tenneco Inc.’s Indian operations?
When I started my professional journey back in 1993, demand for in-house counsels was not so promising. You could make your place by really working hard and constantly meeting the expectations of your employer. It is very important for any new in-house counsel to get an opportunity to work under the guidance of a good senior professional. I consider myself lucky to have got that opportunity.
As you know, learning is a continuous process. I too believe in that, and my quest for knowledge keeps me going.
When you grow, you have to keep in mind that a good and motivated team plays an important role in your success. I always believe in building teams by having transparency, mutual respect & trust, delegation of authority, counselling & coaching and being there for them. I believe in simplification of legal processes.
As a highly accomplished legal professional, what have been the most challenging yet rewarding aspects of aligning legal functions with business requirements throughout your career?
It is a very good question. I always believe that a General Counsel is different from an outside counsel. A GC is expected to understand the business and try to give a solution which not only is in line with the legal framework but always gives a solution to the business. I know this is not easy. One may say that from a legal perspective, either something is permissible or it is not permissible. Based on my experience, I feel that a GC is supposed to provide different workable solutions to the business teams and help them in evaluating and deciding on the best solution.
Being part of the Board of Directors, I am involved in important business decisions. This gives me an edge to review every transaction from a business perspective and provide a legal solution in line with the business requirements.
You’ve navigated through various industries such as Tyre, Financial Services, Chemical, and auto-component sectors. How has your diverse experience shaped your approach to legal strategies and corporate governance?
Different industries that I have worked with have different challenges, requiring different approaches and strategies. For a GC, it is important to understand who your audience is. You need to have the ability to listen to your internal as well as external customers, understand their issues and provide the best legal options/ solutions.
Given your extensive involvement in M&A, joint ventures, and divestitures, could you share some insights into the key strategies and considerations you employ when negotiating complex transactions?
For M&A transactions, the first level of discussion revolves around the feasibility of the new business; what would be its value addition to your existing business and whether it would make a business sense to go for an M&A transaction.
Once a business decision is taken, the second most important task is to do a thorough due diligence of the entire business involving financial, legal and environmental due diligence. In the current scenario, one must understand that environmental issues are highly critical and should be thoroughly evaluated to avoid huge financial liability for violation of environmental laws.
For the success of any joint venture, it is important to ensure a lot of transparency in terms of sharing of important information with the JV partner and involve them in all the important decisions. It is very important to build a relationship, based on mutual trust and respect. This would ensure smooth running of the JV as well as future growth.
How do you balance the need for legal compliance with the demands of business growth, especially in highly regulated sectors such as yours?
As I said earlier, if you understand the business, you can surely provide a legal solution which aligns with the business.
With your expertise in corporate governance and securities, what advice would you offer to companies aiming to enhance their governance standards and navigate regulatory landscapes effectively?
I believe corporate governance is not just complying with the applicable legal provisions. Corporate governance should become part of a company’s culture. It should become the way of life. It has to be followed in the true spirit and, not just as a compliance obligation.
You’ve been instrumental in implementing legal frameworks and adopting legal tech to support business growth. Can you share some examples of how technology has transformed legal operations during your tenure?
Automation of processes is the need of the hour. With a lot of focus on having learner legal teams, it is important to keep working on automation. Compliance management tools, litigation management tools and contract management tools are few examples. These tools have not only saved a lot of time but also helped in ensuring accuracy of processes.
Lastly, drawing from your vast experience, what advice would you give to fresh graduates aspiring to pursue a career in law, especially those aiming for leadership roles in the corporate sector?
My advice would be as follows:
1. First and foremost, it is important to be a good human being. This quality would help you throughout your professional journey.
2. Always believing in learning new things.
3. Try to fully understand and appreciate the perspectives of others. This would help you to provide a better legal solution.
4. Build a good team. Trust and respect your team members. Always focus on the professional growth of your team members.
Could you share a bit about your educational journey, particularly how you transitioned from your LL.B. degree to pursuing LL.M. in Intellectual Property Law at The George Washington University Law School?
While completing my BA.LL.B, I enrolled in a diploma course in Intellectual Property Laws at the Indian Institute of Law during my third year of law school. It was during my fourth year, as part of my curriculum, that I delved deeper into Intellectual Property law, sparking a keen interest in the subject. By the time I reached my final year, my aspiration for higher education had crystallized, leading me to forgo immediate employment in favour of pursuing advanced studies. I applied to several esteemed law schools in both the US and UK renowned for their offerings in Intellectual Property Law. Upon receiving admission to George Washington University, widely recognized for its excellence in this field, my decision was made without hesitation.
Your LL.M. focused on Intellectual Property Law, among other areas. What sparked your interest in this field, and how has this specialization influenced your career path?
I became interested in intellectual property law (IP) while studying it during my undergraduate studies. It is fascinating because it mixes law, technology, creativity, and new ideas. During my LL.M., I became even more interested in the subject. In today’s corporate landscape, whether working as a corporate lawyer for a multinational corporation in industries such as oil and gas, IT, pharmaceuticals, or others, it’s imperative to have a keen awareness of the intellectual property (IP) owned by your company. Understanding how to safeguard these assets from infringement is paramount. My master’s degree in Intellectual Property Law has played a pivotal role in meeting this requirement. I’ve found that understanding and safeguarding intellectual property is crucial for the success of any company. It’s been instrumental in my ability to comprehend and effectively protect the intellectual property assets of the organization I work for.
You’ve had significant experience in both law firms and corporate legal departments. How did these varied experiences shape your understanding of legal practice, especially in the context of intellectual property law and corporate governance?
Upon completing my master’s degree, I sought advice from industry peers and well-wishers who advised me against exclusively focusing on IP at the outset of my career. As a result, I began my career in litigation. After gaining experience in litigation for several years, I transitioned into a role as a corporate lawyer within a software company. It was within this company that I once again engaged with IP matters. Particularly during negotiations for licensing agreements, my prior experience with IP proved invaluable.
Can you elaborate on your role as a Principal Attorney at McDermott, specifically in the domain of sustainability and governance? How do you integrate legal expertise with sustainable practices within a corporate environment?
As Principal Attorney at McDermott, my responsibility is to assist our supply chain team in their endeavours to procure materials and services essential for project execution. In addition to contract negotiation, my team and I provide legal training to enhance their understanding of relevant clauses, thereby empowering them during negotiations. Ensuring adherence to the code of business conduct is paramount in all our activities, particularly concerning sustainability and governance initiatives.
You’ve worked extensively in drafting and negotiating various contracts, including those related to engineering procurement. How do you navigate the complexities of legal frameworks across different jurisdictions, given your experience in regions like the Middle East, India, Europe, and Africa?
In our contractual agreements, we opt for common law as our governing jurisdiction. This choice is deliberate, as contracts governed by common law principles share remarkable similarities across various jurisdictions worldwide. This uniformity simplifies our navigation of legal frameworks and enhances our ability to manage contractual obligations effectively across different regions and jurisdictions.
As someone deeply involved in legal compliance and risk management, how do you stay updated with evolving regulations, especially in areas like intellectual property and corporate mergers?
As someone deeply involved in legal compliance and risk management, staying updated with evolving regulations, especially in areas like intellectual property and corporate mergers, is crucial. I employ various strategies to ensure I’m informed about the latest developments. This includes continuous learning through workshops and seminars, staying updated with legal publications and journals, active participation in professional networks, regular engagement with legal counsel, and monitoring government and regulatory websites for official updates. These efforts enable me to proactively manage legal compliance and mitigate associated risks for our organization.
Transitioning from law school to your current role, what were some of the challenges you faced, and how did you overcome them? Are there any lessons you learned along the way that you would like to share with aspiring legal professionals?
It has been over a decade since I graduated from law school, and I must say, it has been a journey of continuous learning for me. Transitioning from litigation to corporate law posed its challenges. Initially, my experience in litigation wasn’t fully recognized, and I found myself starting from scratch in the corporate world. However, as time progressed, my background in litigation has proven to be advantageous. Today, it gives me a unique edge over other corporate lawyers.
To all aspiring legal professionals, I offer this advice: remain open to learning every day. Be like an empty vessel, ready to absorb new knowledge and experiences. This mindset is essential for growth and success in the legal field.
Finally, considering your journey and expertise, what advice would you give to fresh law graduates aspiring to build a successful career in intellectual property law or corporate governance?
For fresh law graduates aspiring to excel in intellectual property law or corporate governance, specializing and staying informed are paramount. Choose a specific area within these fields and immerse yourself in its intricacies, constantly updating your knowledge with the latest developments and regulations. Practical experience is equally crucial; seek internships or entry-level positions to gain hands-on exposure and insight into real-world applications. Additionally, effective networking is key to building a successful career. Engage with professionals in the industry through events and associations, fostering relationships that can provide valuable guidance and opportunities for growth. By combining specialization, practical experience, and effective networking, aspiring legal professionals can lay a strong foundation for a rewarding career in intellectual property law or corporate governance.
Your journey from college to becoming the Head of Legal at Noida International Airport is impressive. Could you share some of the key challenges you faced during your early career stages and how you overcame them to reach where you are today?
Being a first-generation lawyer, I never had the advantage of family connections or right mentors to guide in navigating the legal landscape and I must admit that I had lacked hands-on training as well that those who have a pedigree in the legal field, receive as a part of their daily routine.
Hence, I decided to overcome these limitations by focusing on my skills, knowledge and professionalism. I accepted internships without stipends, offered pro bono legal services to gain hands-on practical experience and aimed to build a reputation of being a thorough professional with integrity.
I ensured that I proactively network by attending legal seminars and conferences, keep engaging in online legal communities and join professional organizations to meet experienced lawyers and potential employers. In short, “perseverance” and “continuous efforts” are the two key words which have so far been working for me. Touchwood !!
Credit also goes to all those few kind people who understood my approach of working, that is, how I can contribute and bring value to the table and then there was no looking back for me.
What motivated you to transition from litigation to an in-house role, and how has this shift shaped your approach to legal challenges?
Making that decision was a significant career move. What mainly allured me to the in-house role was the opportunity to be an integral part of a company’s decision-making processes.
In order to have a more direct impact on business decisions, the legal function has to work very closely with the business teams and gain deep knowledge of the company’s operations, industry regulations, and strategic goals. I was very clear that this specialized knowledge is invaluable and provides a unique perspective when advising the company on legal matters.
As an in-house counsel, I got opportunities to be intimately involved in shaping and executing corporate strategies, negotiating contracts, managing litigation, and ensuring compliance. This level of involvement allowed me to see and understand the tangible results of the legal advice.
Further, during my litigation days, I realised that a lot of disputes were arising due to some ‘inattentions’ right at the documentation stage. That incited my curiosity about the critical role an in house can play in mitigating such risks right at the start such as making the documents robust enough to firstly prevent disputes from happening and if not then create a good defence.
Having worked with diverse organizations such as GMR, Accenture, Alstom, and now Noida International Airport, could you share a memorable experience or lesson from each phase of your career that significantly influenced your professional growth?
In fact, all the places where I have worked so far have taught me the importance of self-awareness and emotional intelligence. Technically they may offer different things to learn (specific to each sector) but a few common things that I absorbed at all such places is that it is very important to understand the Company’s culture. Any initiatives, external interactions and/or negotiation strategy must be aligned with the company’s culture, work environment and company policies.
I also learnt that productivity is directly proportional to the extent of empowerment. Once I became a part of the leadership group, I realised that empowerment to take decisions is absolutely crucial. Hence, while accepting a new role, I check on the mandates I would be allocated with, without fail.
On the technical front, organisations such as Amplus (Petronas Group) and EverEnviro (EverSource owned) helped me build a strong business acumen which is very critical for in-house resources in order to enable them to play a strategic role in the business decision-making process.
I developed a solid understanding of risk management and operational strategies to effectively contribute to the company’s goals at most of the places I worked at. Further, I got tremendous exposure in the area of framing and administering “compliance” which is especially a challenging area. A change in one aspect, such as corporate governance or any policy or even key managerial personnel, can trigger requirements in multiple entities. As the number of entities and jurisdictions involved rises, so does the risk of non-compliance. I got hands-on experience in project financing for Alstom, Amplus and EverEnviro entities. I remember some very challenging but interesting days from the complex phase of the Amplus acquisition by Petronas, where I lead the Amplus in-house team which handled the complex phases of the acquisition transaction (with adequate support from the external counsels), for the Indian leg of the said transaction.
Alstom provided me a platform where I handled some very high-stake transactions such as the transfer of entire transport business by way of slump sale within Alstom entities; It involved extensive due diligence of the existing records, reviewing and drafting the share purchase agreement, the Business Transfer Agreements, letters to the Customers informing them about this transaction, Assignment and Assumption Agreement etc.
There have been some instances where law firms/external support supporting us with transactions cited a case law to prove a point and incidentally, those specific cases turned out to be not only steered from the conception and handled by me (including briefing to the senior counsel etc.) but also managed to get favourable orders therein. The reactions that I received from the law firms once I told them about it, was priceless and its something I feel very proud of.
You’ve navigated complex transactions and legal landscapes in industries ranging from aviation to waste management. What unique challenges and rewards do you find in working across such varied sectors, and how do you adapt your legal expertise to each industry’s nuances?
That’s right! I have worked across different sectors and therefore I think am rightly placed to humbly disagree with a common notion specific to the legal field that one must focus on specialising in one dedicated sphere. My experience tells me that working with different sectors and organisations helps bring in ductility in the approach to handle different set of tasks. I find myself in a better position to handle a diverse range of legal issues and adapt quickly to the unique demands of each sector, multi-task, and work collaboratively with cross-functional teams.
GMR, Alstom and Noida International Airport helped me gain an insight into the challenges and nuances of working on government contracts and public procurement. Dealing with government contracts is very different from how one negotiates a private contract. Considering the limited room for negotiations in case of the former, the focus is mainly on how to internally mitigate the risk to the maximum extent possible. That’s a very interesting area which provided me with hands-on experience on risk management as an important tool for lawyers and managing complex projects, providing practical advice, and collaborating with clients. Accenture and Amplus (Petronas Group), on the other hand, provided me a platform where I could build a strong business acumen which is very critical for in-house resources in order to enable them to play a strategic role in the business decision-making process.
As it is with changes happening almost on a daily basis such as advent of AI, change in the tax framework, introduction or restructuring of several legislations have let legal teams under intensifying pressure to meet new demands and match the pace of business change. Hence, agility and wider exposure has become critical tools for the general counsels and their teams to better support the broadening spectrum of risk, compliance, governance, operations and regulatory issues, as well as the need to support the business in the execution of its strategy. If you ask me, the future belongs to the generalists with the role of specialists becoming very limited as compared to the present time.
In your role at Noida International Airport, you’re contributing to the development of a greenfield airport. Can you share some insights into the legal intricacies and challenges involved in such large-scale infrastructure projects, and how you ensure compliance while fostering growth?
With any large-scale infrastructure projects or to be specific a Public-Private-Partnership (PPP), one of the biggest challenges is having no scope of negotiations when almost all PPP concessions usually have a term of about thirty (30) years. Running a project of that scale for such a long period on the same terms and conditions is not pragmatic and a major reason for the imbalance that such projects face from time to time. I am not suggesting for a platform to re-negotiate however, public sectors must provide some comfort to the private parties to accommodate events such as prices going up and imports becoming difficult due to for eg. say this Ukrain war. Although there are a lot of changes that are happening where the public sector is becoming sensitive about the day-to-day challenges private sectors have to face while executing the PPP projects, I feel we still have some miles to cover before the former becomes comfortable with the idea that it is okay for the private sector to make some profits. This fundamental understanding will go a long way to regain and/or strengthen investors’ confidence in the PPP projects.
Specifically in the case of Greenfield projects, there are some construction related risks such as physical unexpected events that may occur during construction, which can lead to cost and time overruns. Although concessionaires try to hedge these risks by taking security packages from their contractors and sub-concessionaires, the problem with this approach is the timing. For instance, in most cases, one becomes aware of a technical issue only when the impact of the issue may have consumed a good portion of the security package.
The best way to tackle such risks in Greenfield projects is to focus more on immediate security than freezing those for future. Some of the effective measures to manage this risk are to have wide supervision capability of the works during construction and to have termination clauses negotiated in a way that will not put the project at risk in case of construction delay or technical challenge, and that will give enough room for investors to cure before it is too late (e.g. incrementing resources to the works, penalizing the EPC contractor for any delay, even within the longstop date).
One more risk which is personally very close to my interest is “points of friction” when it comes to risk allocation. As everyone is aware that at the heart of every PPP transaction is the allocation of risks between the public and private partners. Hence, the risks should be fairly and justly distributed between the partners. A lot of background work is already undergoing at the Government’s level to fill in these gaps.
You’ve amassed a wealth of experience over 15 years in the legal field. What motivated you to pursue a Master’s in Business Law at this stage of your career, and how has it enriched your professional perspective?
It was the course structure and content which caught my attention. All the legal themes forming part of this course are more than relevant to my day-to-day scope of activities such as Contracts, IPR, Investment and Environmental Law, Taxation and Banking. I was longing to learn better and came across this course at the right time. It definitely equips those who sign up for it better, with deeper insight into legal issues that may impact / affect their daily work.
You’ve been involved in significant corporate restructuring, including the strategic sale of Amplus to Petronas. What key legal considerations come into play during such transactions, and how do you ensure a smooth legal transition for all parties involved?
I believe a good hold on the regulatory framework surrounding such transactions is a must. For example: it needs to be ascertained if the deal is possible under the Competition law, FEMA (in case foreign elements are involved), SEBI (primarily for listed companies involved) etc., as a first step. Regulatory framework and all permissions required therein are extremely significant and can make or break a deal since the cost of some regulatory approvals may drastically affect the commercial viability of such transactions. Moreover, overlooking a necessary approval could render the resulting deal void or voidable, nullifying the efforts of the parties.
Thorough diligence is equally important where depending on what it reveals, the buyer can negotiate on reduction of the price or constrain the target to provide more robust warranties etc. in order for the deal to continue.
Compliance is another very critical area. The licensing requirements, approval status etc. play a key role in deciding the fate of the deal and definitely the pricing. Nature of the ongoing or potential litigations, terms and conditions of the lending contracts etc. are another area of importance which covers the lawyer’s scope in such transactions.
Open communication channels amongst all parties involved, including employees, customers, suppliers, and investors; assertiveness when it comes to seeking critical information and asking tough questions; solution-oriented approach to resolve deadlocks and uncomfortable situations; and meticulous integration planning which is the backbone of a successful acclimatisation are some of the key traits to ensure a seamless transition in case of any corporate restructuring.
Your career has shifted from being focused on personal milestones to leaving a lasting legacy. Could you elaborate on this change in perspective and share your thoughts on the impact a professional can have beyond projects and numbers?
Well, I think “legacy” is a big word when it comes to my career trajectory. I am far away from that but yes, I do aspire to and take each steps towards achieving a reputation where people remember me as a lawyer of an “indomitable character and integrity” and not just for working on a few good projects and saving an X amount of money for a company. Further, I focus on simplifying the complex. Being an in house I mostly deal with non-legal stakeholders on a daily basis who neither know nor are interested in knowing the legalese. Translating the complexities of law in simple and practical language for them requires tutoring myself as a student on a daily basis when it comes to articulating my thought process. As a result, I get approached with a conviction that things will get addressed.
A legal professional, at least during the initial stages of his/her career, shall focus more on intellectual growth (as the requirement to be educated on current developments that affect the law is a must) and clarity of mind (as it gets trained due to constant thinking of how to apply a law to an apt situation) more than designations and monetary compensation. This profession is one of the few noble ones which helps one develop an overall personality and at the same time provides an opportunity to shape up the society as well. One should leverage that to the fullest extent possible. That will help them leave a lasting legacy.
Beyond your professional accomplishments, what are your personal interests or hobbies that bring balance to your life outside of the legal realm? How do you unwind from the demands of a challenging and dynamic legal career?
By focusing on the objective. The work has to be done and no matter how much the pressure is, if one solely focuses on how to get it implemented, it becomes easier to deal with it and avoid the politics around it.
Also, in order to avoid the negative effects of chronic stress and burnout, I disconnect myself from work and take some time off to replenish and return to the pre-stress level of functioning. This recovery process requires “switching off” from work by having periods of time when I neither engage in work-related activities, nor think about work.
Work-life balance is very important for me, and it would not have been possible without my extremely supporting family. They have been with me through thick and thin and an integral part of my journey!! Hence, I try to do whatever I can to squeeze out as much time for them as possible, such as I try to finish a lot of work on my commute so that I can save a few hours there and be at home in time to spend some quality time with them. Additionally, I take a few days off every 4 to 5 months to spend some time exclusively with family.
It would not be fair if I don’t give due credit to some of my very supportive colleagues. Good colleagues and a supportive team are an asset. They will take care of you when you are down or not on the best days at work. So such support functions are a direct blessing from God !! Take my word on it!! 😊
My leisure time gets consumed in reading books, watching a good movie / documentary and my perpetual stressbuster is discussing politics. I really enjoy having a good conversation around how the geo-political landscape is turning out to be.
I ensure that I take one hour at least everyday when I only introspect, listen to music and read an article/book.
As someone who has worked internationally and dealt with compliance on a global scale, how do you stay updated on the ever-evolving legal landscape, and what advice do you have for legal professionals aiming for a global perspective in their careers?
To be updated about the latest legal developments and on a real time basis is not just a choice; it’s a necessity. I try to stay informed with the timely updates with help of professional networks, relevant law firm practice group newsletters/updates that I have signed up for (i.e. the firms regularly provide guidance on legislative and regulatory changes), and by following relevant industry experts, law firms, and other thought leaders on LinkedIn who focuses on regulatory updates and compliance matters. Invest in your knowledge by participating in seminars, conferences, or web-based training sessions that offer guidance on the implementation of new regulations. Alternatively, review professional summaries to ensure you understand key aspects like involved parties, prerequisites, due dates, and penalties. Knowledge is the cornerstone of compliance.
For those who are aiming high, I would like to make one thing very clear that there are no clear rules of how to operate in the legal industry. On the other hand, unwritten rules are plenty in number! In order to achieve a global reach it is very important to have a global mindset to start with. By global mindset I don’t mean being able to do things but more about the ability to understand the complexities and nuances of global legal frameworks and environment, for eg., to follow, extract and adapt the best practices from other geographies, to be able to understand and tab on the trade-offs between local requirements and global standardisation.
You’ve had an extensive career spanning over 14 years in the legal field. What inspired you to pursue a career in law, and how has your journey evolved from your early days to your current role as Director – Legal & compliance at Aurionpro?
A deep interest in Humanities since my school days and an unusual career choice are the two prime factors that inspired me to pursue law as a profession. For me, Law as a career was never a substitute, rather it was deeply ingrained in my mind as I find it extremely intellectually challenging. The journey, so far has been quite enriching and fulfilling coupled with highs and lows. There have been some noteworthy remarkable achievements – be it an association with National Payments of India (NPCI) during its inception, which is the Centre of India’s world-acclaimed digital revolution or an association with Micro land where my promptness to business requirements despite time zone difference was widely appreciated by both the external and internal stakeholders. Nonetheless, it is explicitly implied that my achievements so far have been an outcome of all the learnings and experiences that I gained in various organisations with diversified job profiles but with a common goal of business progression. The current role as Director – Legal & Compliance has ushered in a new leadership segment to my journey. The tenure to this point has been quite challenging and satisfying marked with freedom of decision-making and leading the organisation from legal standpoint.
What unique challenges or experiences in your various roles have had the most significant impact on your growth as a legal professional?
Law as a profession is known to be ever challenging irrespective of the years of experience gained. However, for me, one of the common unique challenging experiences across all the organisation has been in the form of adapting and doing deep-dive in understanding the organisation’s business so as to be positioned to provide suitable legal opinion and guidance without hindering the business growth. The opportunity to be associated with NPCI during its inception time, came with an ardent task of managing and setting up the Legal Department solely, which I navigated through every day learning and guidance from an external Legal Consultant from RBI. The journey is a milestone in my career graph as I am extremely proud to be associated with the roll out of some landmark products such as IMPS, RuPay Domestic Card, Aadhar which have made India standout in the financial world across the globe. This has been an extremely satisfying engagement which keeps me inspired in my current role as well.
Beyond your role as a legal professional, you’ve conducted legal awareness sessions and training. What motivated you to take on this role, and how do you believe legal education contributes to a more robust business environment?
Legal awareness and training sessions are equally important in one’s career as they give you a completely different perspective and outlook. It helps in broadening your learning horizon. This also entails first educating yourself from various journals and through deep research from the open domain. The conduct of training sessions gives an opportunity to interact with a variety of audience from various sectors and knowing their perspective and thought process. The questions and queries posed provides you ample in-depth knowledge and broaden your spectrum with solid foundation. The legal awareness and education are essential for robust and healthy business environment as we have seen so many businesses failing due to financial roadblocks and a lack of adherence to legal compliances. The current corporate world has realised the importance and this is visible in the form of a surge in the demand of seasoned legal professionals.
Having managed legal and compliance workflows across continents, how do you ensure that your approach aligns with diverse regulatory landscapes, especially in the APAC, AFRICA, and MIDDLE-EAST regions?
The legal and compliance workflows across continents and geos do require in-depth studies about various regulatory aspects of different countries and devising a solution in alignment with the same without hindering business growth. This also requires engagement with local legal team for any local conflict resolution for business to proceed further without much delay. Promptness and Collaboration are key in handling such diverse regulatory landscape.
As a legal leader, you’ve been involved in setting roadmaps and providing quick assistance to internal stakeholders. How do you balance legal rigor with the need for agile and efficient business operations?
Sound legal knowledge, strong work ethics and practical solutions to any problems have been my forte. I was fortunate to have been engaged in various diverse projects since the inception of my legal journey which has given me the adequate opportunity to play a key role in business decision-making. Besides, being part of the business team in various meetings and discussions has additionally helped me gain a better grasp of the business requirements.
Beyond the legal domain, are there specific activities or hobbies that you engage in to unwind from the demands of your role? How do you strike a balance between your professional and personal life?
I do engage myself in travelling around and exploring new places both in India as well as abroad. I also engage myself with music and reading especially new developments in the industry that I am associated with. I do value time and believe in balancing both my professional and personal commitments and growth.
Looking ahead, what’s a legal or compliance frontier you’re excited to explore or address in the coming years, and how do you see it shaping the industry?
Looking ahead, the legal or compliance frontier that I am excited to explore or address would be either in the Euro Zone or the U.S.A. to further upskill my international exposure.
Having worked with various organizations, you’ve likely encountered emerging legal professionals. If you were to advise the current generation of legal enthusiasts, what crucial skills or knowledge areas do you believe they should focus on to excel in today’s legal landscape?
My advice to the current generation of legal enthusiast would be to have a very strong foundation and knowledge about the core legal subject-matter, develop an agile approach rather than following a set pattern and be open to new learnings at every stage. Learning coupled with application makes a worthy lawyer.
You have an extensive career in the legal field, spanning various industries and positions. Can you share your personal journey and what initially sparked your interest in law?
To talk about my background, I was born and brought up in Mumbai and I come from a family of doctors and engineers. No one from my family has worked in the field of corporate law and hence I am a first-generation corporate lawyer. My parents, now retired, were both hardworking individuals and were working. My father worked as a CS (Company Secretary) in various companies and my mother was in government service. Hard work and a zeal to learn was thus instilled in me from a very young age, since I grew up watching my working parents. I have completed my B.com and LLB from the Mumbai University along with a couple of additional diplomas and certifications. I was initially interested in being a Company Secretary (CS) which is a professional course, however my inclination towards being a corporate lawyer grew once I started studying law.
It was only after studying law alongside CS, I realized that it is of my interest and I would want to pursue it as my career. Law can be complex and challenging due to its interpretation at times and I enjoyed decoding its interpretation and studying its application. I cannot really point to a specific reason for choosing law – I just had a sense that in future the legal profession would gain importance & distinction, and I am very glad that it did.
As a seasoned professional with experience in law firms, manufacturing, and FMCG sectors, can you tell us about the most significant challenges you’ve encountered in each sector and how you navigated them?
That’s a very good question! A general perception about lawyers is that we know and do everything under the sun. However, one must know that the skills required for every vertical and industry differ from each other and while we know the foundation, many times it’s more of learning on the go for us.
I started my career with a law firm named, Oasis Counsel & Advisory (Chambers of Senior Counsel, Mr. Haresh Jagtiani) and I must say that my first taste of practical applicability of law and litigation was very exciting. Like every other law student, I too started my internships with law firms and while at Oasis, as an intern, my work mainly focussed on researching on case laws, finding precedents and drafting short documents like affidavits and letters. I qualified as a lawyer in 2014 and was lucky enough to be absorbed as an associate at Oasis. The kind of work that is handled at law firms is completely different than at corporates. At Oasis the challenges that I faced related to drafting court documents and handling clients at such a nascent stage of my career. I was blessed with amazing mentors during my tenure there who guided me to the right path and taught me the intricacies of practicing law. I would say that starting my career with a law firm was the best decision since this made my foundation of understanding law and the interpretation of it very strong.
Post this came my biggest challenge of transitioning from a law firm to a corporate since there is vast difference in the working culture and the system in general. For eg. In a law firm you deal with one client at a time, at a corporate you deal with multiple stakeholders which involves business partnering. One needs to align their goals with the vision and values the organization holds. The manufacturing sector is pretty compliance specific, and my role at PPG Asian Paints as well as Blue Star Limited, being a generalist one, included everything right from drafting contracts, identifying and ensuring compliances, handling trademarks and patents and business advisory. Wearing multiple hats and getting work done was challenging here, but then again my seniors helped me out and ensured that along with getting the work done it also gives me a good learning and enriching experience.
Post PPG Asian Paints, I worked with Bajaj Consumer Care Limited (BCCL) for a short while. BCCL is the FMCG wing of the Bajaj Group. It was a different industry than PPGAP and that’s what made it interesting. I worked extensively with the marketing and R&D teams on product claims and product packages, distributor contracts and IPR. It was during my time here, I learnt about product development and all the groundwork that happens on the same – on the legal front this was my first time working with and learning the workings of The Drugs & Cosmetics Act, The Advertising Standards Council of India (ASCI) guidelines, The Legal Metrology Act and International Trademarks. Quite an exciting space to be in. The challenge here was meeting tight deadlines before product launches. This included drafting of the product claims along with the R&D team, approving artworks, approving advertisement scripts in line with the ASCI guidelines and then gearing up for the product launch. The best way to overcome any challenge is to get adapted to the environment that you are in. Also, asking people around really helps. The business teams here were collaborative and hence the challenge no longer seemed like one.
You’ve been involved in areas such as consultation and advisory, civil and commercial law, and corporate and cyber law drafting. How do you balance such a diverse skill set, and how has it contributed to your success in the legal profession?
Working in multiple sectors helped me build acumen on the diverse skill set that I possess today. Even after a decade of experience in this profession, I am still as curious as a beginner and that helps me in honing my skills and learnings further. In house roles do require wearing multiple hats and catering to the needs of various divisions in the company, therefore, one cannot limit themselves to only one stream of law. My observation has been that most of the mid/large cap companies in India prefer having a counsel with a generalist experience rather than a specialised one and that’s what sets you above the rest. Balancing a diverse skill set can be challenging, but staying up to date with amendments and changes in your field is a must, especially, when the field is as dynamic as the legal gamut in India.
Could you share some notable milestones and achievements from your career, especially in your current role at Mahindra & Mahindra Limited?
Of course! As an in-house counsel, simply knowing the law is not enough. In-house counsels deal with a lot of complex transactions which need a deeper understanding of the business and its technicalities. Therefore, the first step that a corporate lawyer needs to excel in is business partnering. All my milestones have been possible due to business partnering in all the projects that I worked on and I cherish each of these milestones equally. However, if I have to point out specific ones, it would be implementation of compliance tools at two of the organizations I worked with. While I was working with PPG Asian Paints and Blue Star, I got the opportunity to digitize compliance reporting and monitoring. This helped the companies to a great extent since we transitioned from manual work to robust softwares. It involved a lot of effort and time since we had to coordinate with multiple functions and stakeholders before finalizing the compliances. I was recognized and rewarded for this effort at both the organizations and hence it’s one of my close memorable experiences. I have also handled and closed POSH complaints as a member of the IC committee at one of the organizations which was a huge learning experience and which I consider as a milestone too.
At Mahindra & Mahindra Limited (M&M), I am a part of the business legal team for the farm equipment sector. I have been a part of various benchmarking exercises through which we implemented anti-counterfeit strategies in the Agri space. Also worked extensively on the Drone Rules, 2021 and on drone operations in India. Since we have a lot of exposure to international markets, we devised a risk mitigation matrix for our contracts in Europe & China. That’s the benefit of working for large conglomerates, the diversity of the work that one can handle has no bounds.
You’ve held positions involving compliance, policy development, and risk mitigation. How do you approach the complex task of ensuring legal compliance for your organizations, and what advice do you have for legal professionals working in this area?
As we are aware, ESG (Environmental, Social, and Governance) is the buzzword in our field currently. ESG is a framework used to assess an organization’s business practices and performance on various sustainability and ethical issues. It also provides a way to measure business risks and opportunities in those areas. Organisations worldwide are becoming ESG compliant for their investors and shareholders. Be it in the form of disclosures in the board reports, accountability to the shareholders or the reputation of an organization, ethics & compliance are the two very important aspects of conducting any business these days.
Having said that, I believe that ensuring ethics & compliance is never a one man’s job – the compliance manager therefore has to collaborate with every function of the organization, create awareness, conduct training and instill the importance of compliance in every employee working at the ground & top level. There has to be constant talk about compliance in the organization along with tone from the top. I am fortunate enough to have worked with leaders who have always kept compliance at the forefront and this helped me drive compliance at all the organizations I worked with.
My advice to professionals working in the area of compliance would be to stay updated with the changing laws and rules. Implementation of a digital tool helps and supports in this regard. Compliance training and awareness sessions are equally important, be it in the form of mailers, quizzes, celebrating compliance week etc. One can start with a compliance audit as a dipstick to check where their organisation stands today. A good starting point could also be to go through the ISO 37301:2021 for Compliance management systems. This document specifies requirements and provides guidelines for establishing, developing, implementing, evaluating, maintaining and improving an effective compliance management system within an organization.
As someone who’s been recognized for your efforts and contributions, what key factors have contributed to your professional recognition in the field of law, and what advice do you have for others aspiring to make a meaningful impact in their legal careers?
In my case, thinking outside the box has immensely helped me. Especially as in house counsels, we need to constantly think about initiatives that will reduce manual work and move towards digitization. Being proactive and actively partnering with the business teams always gets recognized. For example: conducting knowledge sharing sessions for awareness, standardising templates, making risk mitigation matrixes helps the cross functional teams and also reduces future efforts, so that you can focus on more important things at work. Everything counts when one gets recognized, with a primary focus on the change that you have brought about in the organization. Recognition comes in when you move out from your comfort zone and do more than just your KRA’s. My advice would therefore be don’t limit yourself. Do whatever work that comes your way, it’ll certainly not go unnoticed and will be a learning experience for you!
As you’ve achieved success in your career, what advice would you like to offer to fresh graduates who are just starting their legal journey or considering a career in law?
I get asked a lot, especially by young law students, on whether they should start their career as an in-house counsel or with a law firm. It’s of course their preference, however I would suggest starting out with a law firm. Corporates in India do not really have many entry level vacant positions for freshers. They are always on the lookout for someone with law firm experience or someone shifting from another corporate. Also, as I mentioned earlier, a law firm experience would give a good foundational base of law which would really help fresh graduates at a later part of their careers.
Other than this, a few takeaways for aspiring fresh lawyers are as below:
Unless you ask, the answer is always no: we as humans, have the fear of being rejected. And this fear holds us back from taking the first step. I would say take the step anyway. You’ll either succeed or fail. Same goes with asking people for help at organizations. For being a successful corporate lawyer, knowing law alone is not enough. You need to collaborate with business teams effectively for valuable inputs and commercial reasoning. Therefore, be curious, ask multiple questions and most importantly, ask for help whenever required.
While at work, do anything and everything that comes your way: In the initial years, do not be picky with the kind of work that is handed over to you. Every assignment comes with a learning curve which will help you in some way or the other in the long run. Experiment with whatever comes your way and be a lifelong student!
Do not take up a profile which matches 100% with your previous role: Taking up a profile exactly similar to the previous one limits your growth. There should always be room for learning and doing more. Growth starts when you move out of your comfort zone.
Wishing all the readers a rewarding and fulfilling career!
Your career journey reflects a mix of corporate dynamism and legal finesse. Can you share a defining moment or experience that led you into the world of law and compliance?
Well, thank you for putting it so nicely. In 2011, I joined the compliance team of India bulls right after completing my graduation from Sri Venkatestwara College, University of Delhi. However, my academic tryst with the Law started much earlier in 2008 when I decided to pursue Company Secretary professional course which primarily introduced me to legal world of corporate law as this course involves an intensive study of different branches of laws namely taxation, finance, business ethics, labor, costing, capital market and securities laws, etc which regulate different stages of a business entity viz. incorporation, operations and expansion, merger and amalgamations, infusion of capital, liquidation and winding-up.
While doing my CS internship, I chanced upon an opportunity to review a NDA, instinctively I expressed my interest in vetting other contracts and my superior guided my way through it and encouraged me to study IPR laws and take the DU law entrance exam. Thus, study of one branch of law led me into another and ultimately to the realm of general corporate advisory.
Managing a team at Saga Legal, leading corporate advisory, and handling compliance – it sounds like a lot on your plate! How do you maintain work-life balance, and what’s your go-to stress buster outside the legal realm?
I wish that it is not seen as an endorsement of the 70 hours week rule in any manner whatsoever, having said thatbeing occupied is my ZEN. Honestly, I really do not find my work stressful though meeting deadlines can be overwhelming at times. But what fun life would be without a hustle!
Also, apart from hitting the sack, setting out on a retail therapy/street food hopping/reading are my next best stress busters.
You’ve been recognized for your achievements at HCL, Airtel, and beyond. Could you share a particularly rewarding moment or accomplishment in your career that brought a smile to your face?
Like any other individual, awards and rewards always cheer my heart up and work as a shot in the arm to strive harder to do better than the best.
It is not every day that you wake up going to receive a gold medal. I really thank my stars to have got one from the Indian Law Institute for earning a diploma in IPR Laws.
Awards and recognition become extremely special when you get them at the time when you least expect it and you are quietly doing your good damn job.
Having said that, I do not want to sound less grateful to any of the opportunities or accomplishments that have come my way in the past 12 years of my work experience. Every “thank you” email /text from a colleague or a client, every town hall meet, every R&R session counts. I always believe and say BEST IS YET TO COME!
Your articles at Bar & Bench showcase a depth of legal analysis. Can you take us through your writing process? What inspires your choice of legal topics, and how do you balance the technical aspects for a broader audience?
Interestingly, topics of all these articles so far have been influenced by the real time legal problem statements which I have encountered during my current advisory practices vis a vis latest legal development impacting the same. It is important to write relevant and informative articles.
I put my best efforts in order to ensure that articles are structured in the most lucid way possible. The preface and conclusion usually are drafted in a manner which can be understood by a business and legal person both. The body paragraphs are mainly where the techno-legal analysis is captured, which exhibit insights from domestic as well as international laws, judicial precedences and commercial and economic factors and impact of the issues in hand.
Beyond the legal realm, your education includes a diverse range of experiences, from Commerce to Company Secretaryship and Law. How has this interdisciplinary background shaped your approach to legal problem-solving, and do you see any unexpected connections between these fields that have proven valuable in your career?
Absolutely, having a multi-skill set always helped me in approaching the legal problems in a more holistic way. My interdisciplinary background has equipped me to adopt a threefold approach to arrive at commercially viable and compliant legal solutions for our clients.
Risk Identification: My foremost concern is to identify risk for the organization (legal, commercial, financial, regulatory) attached to the transaction.
Commercial Impact: Once risk is identified, approach is to eliminate/mitigate any terms which can substantially affect the organization commercially/financially.
Compliance Cost Management: As a compliance professional, I always keep an eye open for compliances attached to terms to be agreed under an agreement. Cost of compliance should never exceed the ROI.
In addition to your legal expertise, you’ve volunteered at the Commonwealth Games in 2010. Can you share a memorable experience from that time, and how do you think volunteering contributes to personal and professional growth?
If I can recall it correctly, our country got this opportunity to host CWG 2010 with great effort after beating Canada in one of the bids. I consider myself fortunate to have participated in a historic event like this. I was put to a screening process in Feb, 2010 and got selected along with other 20k odd volunteers. My general and role specific training were organized at Amity University Campus by some of the distinguished personalities. As a volunteer, I was trained for various aspects like medical support, disaster management, gender sensitivity and protocols (VVIP’s, media and athletes protocol).
During my volunteer experience at R.K. Khanna Tennis Stadium, I organically picked up the skills of project management, prompt decision making, creating and rotating a mix of individuals with right skill as well as will to get the show running no matter what.
Talking about experience, for me as a college student back then, it was surreal to witness national as well as international tennis sensations practicing and playing on the ground teaching the importance of resoluteness, consistency and constantly up-skilling one’s game.
Cherry on top was to see our country’s players win the game that evening and the tunes of the national anthem playing in the backdrop. A memory of this event is still so fresh in my mind and I fondly remember the people I met and the positive transformational impact it had on my approach to deal with life personally and professionally.
You’ve been recognized as one of the “Top 10 Best Women Leaders in Legal Consultants 2023” by Women Entrepreneur India. How does it feel to receive such accolades, and what advice would you give to aspiring women leaders in the legal profession?
It feels really awesome to be adjudged and be put next to my contemporaries and senior colleagues in the fraternity who constantly amaze and inspire me with their exceptional work and leadership. My life motto is She who dares, wins. So I would urge aspiring women leaders in the legal profession not to limit themselves to a mere box of existing ideas and ideologies and keep pushing the envelope. Be enterprising enough to command and create a healthy and safe work environment full of nothing but merits and sheer talent.
Can you please tell us about your journey and how you ended up pursuing a career in law? What inspired you to choose this profession?
I come from a non-legal background. Following my completion of school, I enrolled at Delhi University to pursue a degree in History (Hons) while simultaneously preparing for a law entrance exam. Progressing further, I participated in several entrance exams and achieved an impressive rank in the GGSIP university entrance exam. This accomplishment led me to join Amity Law School (GGSIP University), conveniently located in my hometown of Delhi. It took a few semesters to gain a comprehensive understanding of the field of law as a subject, and I further expanded my knowledge through internships, gaining insight into its practical applications.
During my time at law school, my areas of particular interest revolved around company law and the realms of International Trade and Intellectual Property. This focus guided my trajectory, leading me to specialize in corporate laws with a specific inclination towards the intricacies of commercial contracts and advisory.
With over 14 years of experience in legal advisory, litigation, and compliance, could you share some of the most significant challenges you have faced in your career and how you overcame them?
I started my career as an In-house counsel with a Korean multinational corporation. Being the first Indian employee in this role, I was entrusted with the responsibility of initiating operations from the Korean MNC’s representative office and establishing a subsidiary within India. This task presented challenges, yet it captivated my interest as I navigated through the intricacies of elucidating legal obligations and confronting day-to-day hurdles associated with the establishment of a wholly owned subsidiary in the Indian context. Beyond managing routine responsibilities, I also collaborated with the headquarters to address legal inquiries pertaining to significant contracts involving government public sector undertakings (PSUs) and private enterprises in India. Throughout my professional journey, my primary area of expertise and interest has revolved around General Corporate law as a practice. My predominant focus lies in facilitating transactions, encompassing activities such as conducting thorough due diligence, managing transactional documentation, providing advisory services, and extensively engaging with a broad spectrum of corporate and commercial legal affairs for privately held companies.
Navigating this journey as a recent law graduate came with its share of challenges, particularly when faced with the task of addressing inquiries and managing responsibilities independently, without the luxury of guidance. Being the sole In-house counsel at the time, I had no support to rely upon, and this situation added an extra layer of complexity to my role.
As a member of the Bar Council of Delhi, you have a strong command over commercial, civil, criminal law, commercial disputes, and arbitration matters. How do you manage such diverse areas of expertise, and what advice would you give to aspiring lawyers looking to specialize in multiple legal fields?
As a practicing in House counsel has to wear multiple ‘Hats’. Maintaining proficiency in diverse areas of law, especially within the domains of commercial, civil, criminal law, commercial disputes, and arbitration matters, requires a strategic approach and a commitment to continuous learning. Here’s how one might manage such a range of legal expertise:
Foundational Knowledge: Start by building a strong foundation in each area of law. This involves studying the fundamental principles, key statutes, and landmark cases that pertain to each field.
Continuous Learning: The legal landscape is constantly evolving. Stay updated with changes in laws, regulations, and judicial interpretations across all the fields you’re focusing on. This might involve regularly attending legal seminars, workshops, webinars, and reading industry publications.
Time Management: Juggling multiple fields requires effective time management. Allocate specific time blocks for each area of expertise, ensuring that you’re dedicating sufficient time to remain well-versed in each one.
Mentorship and Networking: Connect with seasoned professionals who specialize in each field. Their guidance and insights can offer invaluable practical knowledge that complements your theoretical understanding.
Technology and Research Tools: Leverage technology and legal research tools to efficiently gather information across multiple fields. Online databases and legal research platforms can help streamline your information gathering process.
Practical Experience: Practical experience is crucial. Engage in internships, clerkships, or positions where you can gain hands-on exposure in each field. Practical insights often solidify theoretical knowledge.
Adaptability: Be adaptable and open to change. Legal fields can evolve rapidly, and being flexible in your approach allows you to incorporate new developments effectively.
Remember that gaining expertise in multiple legal fields is an ongoing process. It requires dedication, curiosity, and a willingness to embrace challenges as opportunities for growth.
In your current role as Associate Director Legal & Compliance – Chief Compliance Officer & Product Legal at VerSe Innovation Private Limited, what are some of the most critical compliance challenges you face in the digital media industry? How do you ensure compliance with the Information Technology (Intermediary Guidelines and Digital Media Ethics Code) Rules, 2021?
As the Associate Director Legal & Compliance – Chief Compliance Officer & Product Legal at VerSe Innovation Private Limited, I face a number of critical compliance challenges in the digital media industry. These include:
• Data privacy and security: The digital media industry is constantly generating and collecting large amounts of user data. This data is often sensitive and must be protected from unauthorized access, disclosure, or misuse.
• Intellectual property protection: The digital media industry is also a major creator and user of intellectual property, such as copyrights, trademarks, and patents. It is important to ensure that this intellectual property is properly protected from infringement.
• Content moderation: The digital media industry faces a challenge in moderating the content that is published on its platforms. This content can range from harmful or illegal content to content that is simply offensive or controversial. It is important to strike a balance between freedom of expression and the need to protect users from harm.
• Compliance with local laws and regulations: The digital media industry is subject to a variety of local laws and regulations, which can vary from country to country. It is important to stay up-to-date on these laws and regulations and to ensure that the company is in compliance with them.
The Information Technology (Intermediary Guidelines and Digital Media Ethics Code) Rules, 2021 (IT Rules 2021) are a set of regulations that govern the functioning of intermediaries and digital media platforms in India. These rules impose a number of obligations on intermediaries and digital media platforms, such as the removal of harmful content, the appointment of a grievance officer, and the compliance with a code of ethics.
I ensure compliance with the IT Rules 2021 by:
• Establishing a robust compliance framework: This framework includes policies and procedures for managing data privacy, intellectual property, content moderation, and compliance with local laws and regulations.
• Providing training to employees: Employees are regularly trained on the company’s compliance policies and procedures.
• Monitoring compliance: The company has a system for monitoring compliance with the IT Rules 2021 and other relevant laws and regulations.
• Responding to complaints: The company has a system for responding to complaints about the content that is published on its platforms.
I believe that these measures are effective in ensuring compliance with the IT Rules 2021 and other relevant laws and regulations. However, the digital media industry is constantly evolving, and it is important to be prepared for new challenges that may arise in the future.
You have provided legal advice for various strategic commercial projects and technology deployments. Can you share a specific project that you found particularly challenging and how you navigated the legal complexities involved?
One project that I found particularly challenging was the development of a new machine learning powered content moderation platform. The platform was designed to automatically detect and remove harmful content from VerSe Innovation’s platforms. However, there were a number of legal challenges that needed to be addressed in order to develop and deploy the platform.
One challenge was the need to comply with the IT Rules 2021. These rules require intermediaries and digital media platforms to remove harmful content, in accordance with the verbiage in the IT Rules 2021. This meant that we had to carefully consider the different types of content that could be considered harmful and develop a system for detecting and removing this content as per the platform policies .
We also had to consider the potential impact of the platform on freedom of expression. The platform would be able to remove content that was considered harmful, but it was important to strike a balance between protecting users from harm and allowing for freedom of expression. We navigated the legal complexities involved in this project by working closely with the company’s moderation and engineering team. The platform has been successful in removing harmful content from VerSe Innovation’s platforms and has helped to create a safer and more inclusive online environment.
I learned a lot from this project about the challenges of developing and deploying new technologies in the digital media industry. I also learned the importance of working closely with tech team and content moderation experts to navigate the legal complexities involved in these projects.
Throughout your career, you have been involved in drafting, reviewing, and negotiating various agreements, including technology, gaming, banking, and real estate agreements. What key aspects do you consider when reviewing and negotiating these agreements, and what are some common pitfalls that people should be aware of?
During my professional journey, my involvement in drafting, reviewing, and negotiating a range of agreements spanning technology, gaming, banking, and real estate has highlighted several crucial aspects to consider, as well as common pitfalls to avoid;
(i) an agreement must use clear, unambiguous language to define terms, obligations, and rights of the parties involved;
(ii) the draft agreement clearly outlines the scope and purpose of the agreement. This helps prevent misunderstandings regarding the parties’ intentions;
(iii) explicitly detail the responsibilities and obligations of each party;
(iv) the draft should address intellectual property rights, licenses, and permissions thoroughly. determine who owns what, and how rights are granted or licensed;
(v) clearly define payment terms, including amounts, frequency, and methods of payment. Include provisions for late payments, interest, and penalties;
(vi) outline the conditions under which the agreement can be terminated and the process for doing so. Address any consequences of termination;
(vii) specify the mechanisms for resolving disputes, whether through negotiation, mediation, arbitration, or litigation;
(viii) establish protocols for handling confidential information and trade secrets, including restrictions on disclosure and use;
(x) address liabilities, including limitations on liability, indemnification obligations, and insurance requirements;
(xi) Account for unforeseen events that might impact the execution of the agreement, such as natural disasters or unforeseen circumstances.
Common Pitfalls to Avoid:
Incomplete or Ambiguous Terms: Vague or incomplete clauses can lead to misunderstandings and disputes down the line.
Ignoring Local Laws: Failing to consider applicable laws and regulations can result in non compliance and legal issues.
Unequal Bargaining Power: Negotiating parties with disparate power dynamics can lead to unfair terms or misunderstandings.
Lack of Exit Strategy: Without clear exit provisions, parties might face challenges when terminating an agreement prematurely.
Weak Dispute Resolution Mechanisms: Poorly defined dispute resolution processes can prolong conflicts and escalate costs.
When reviewing and negotiating agreements, it’s essential to consult with the business team who have specific the real intent of the deal or transaction. As a legal professional, I can help identify potential issues, offer solutions, and ensure that the agreement aligns with the parties’ intentions and relevant legal frameworks.
You have also advised on fundraisers and conducted due diligence on M&A activities. What are the essential factors to consider during due diligence, particularly in terms of data privacy, anti-corruption, and product compliance?
A legal due diligence report is a comprehensive review of a target company’s legal compliance status. It typically includes a review of the company’s corporate compliance, contracts, licenses, employees, properties, intellectual property, and litigation. The report is used to identify any potential legal risks associated with the company and to help the investor
negotiate the transaction documents. The outcome of the due diligence process can have a significant impact on the negotiations of the transaction documents. The report should highlight any risks that the investor may face and propose solutions or mitigation strategies. It is also important to complete the due diligence process in a timely manner so that the definitive agreements can be negotiated and executed.
The essential factors to consider during due diligence, particularly in terms of data privacy, anti-corruption, and product compliance, include:
• Data privacy: This includes the collection, use, and storage of personal data. You need to ensure that the company complies with all applicable data privacy laws and regulations.
• Anti-corruption: This includes the prevention of bribery and other corrupt practices. You need to ensure that the company has in place adequate anti-corruption controls, such as a code of conduct and a whistleblowing policy.
• Product compliance: This includes ensuring that the company’s products comply with all applicable laws and regulations. This can be a complex area, as there are many different laws and regulations that may apply, depending on the product, market and the user base.
As a seasoned professional, what advice would you give to fresh graduates who are entering the legal field? Are there any skills or areas of specialization that you would recommend focusing on for a successful legal career?
Fresh law graduates should focus on developing a deep understanding of their practice area and the laws relating to it. This is important because it will give them a strong foundation for their career. It is also important to be patient and willing to learn. There is no one right way to practice law, and it takes time to find your own style. Don’t be afraid to explore different areas of law, but be prepared to put in the hard work to succeed. It is also important to never get discouraged. The legal profession is a demanding one, but it is also very rewarding. There is always room for improvement, so keep learning and growing. Some key qualities or skills that are important for fresh law graduates include:
• Discipline: Being able to manage your time and stay focused on your work.
• Willingness to learn: Being open to new ideas and feedback.
• Updating yourself every day: Keeping up with the latest legal developments.
• Hard work and street-smart work: Being willing to put in the effort to succeed.
• Being a team player: Being able to work effectively with others.
• Time management: Being able to manage your time effectively.
What motivated you to take law as a career and how has been the decision so far?
Law was appealing at the level of ideas when I was young. In law school, like at NUJS, said ideas tend to get affirmed (absent extraordinary circumstances). For those of us who didn’t grow up with lawyers in the family, some self-selection invariably occurs. Since law wasn’t part of the Indian board curriculum in my time, certain proxies, such as affinities for logic, language, argument, etc., informed the decision-making process. I’m not sure if these proxies are useful, let alone representative, but we do rely on them disproportionately at that stage of life, given informational and experiential scarcity.
It’s been a pretty good journey so far. I’ve lucked out over time with regard to being able to dabble variously, and I enjoy diverse aspects and manifestations of the law. I look forward to more learning.
Your internship experiences are filled with renowned firms and other reputed people, was there any roadmap for the same or all did was in flow? How would you guide students in choosing internships?
I suppose these things are part of an organic trajectory, perhaps steered by a latent sense of purpose. Things do happen in a flow, but we ultimately end up navigating viable paths. Curiosity helps. I see students these days choose internships based on niche interests and very specific practice areas. I admire such clarity, especially at that young an age. While it’s difficult to know yourself completely in law school, elimination is useful. However, I still think that sampling from a large spread is a good idea before marrying into the unknown.
Could you shed some light on your journey in the topmost university, Fletcher? I’d love to know the flashbacks.
Fletcher was a cherished destination. Even when I first joined S&R Associates (where I currently work), I had an idea that I might want to explore a specialization later, preferably in a different country. I liked Fletcher because of many things, but most of all for the flexibility and eclectic environment that it offered. The crowd is truly diverse and international, and my ways of looking at the world changed fundamentally when I came out.
The best memories are perhaps the simplest ones, the quiet neighbourhood, the bucolic surroundings, the redbrick buildings, hours spent inside the ‘Harry Potter Room’, trudging to Harvard amidst the first snow of winter, and endless cups of coffee with friends. Add to that, the opportunity to genuinely engage with people from various walks of life, from various parts of the world, from contexts wildly different from yours: that kind of exposure is irreplaceable.
Deborshi, among all the specialisations, i.e., in MALD, LLM, and Ph.D. Fletcher’s programme, what do you find the most interesting to you? How far did you use all this expertise in your practical areas of work?
I liked the Master of Arts in Law & Diplomacy (MALD) program because it gave me the chance to keep law as a base and build on that substratum by adding disciplinary layers to it, including those involving public policy, political economy, international relations, comparative politics, global history, research methods, national security, foreign policy, international organizations, transnational business, and others. The MALD remains Fletcher’s keystone graduate program, and for good reason.
Also, it’s a 2-year program, as opposed to the 1-year LLM. I’d heard from others before me that a year’s duration often feels too short from a learning perspective, and I wanted a more immersive experience.
I received two awards as a student under the MALD program: the William L. Blue and Joan R. Blue Scholarship, and the Alfred P. Rubin Prize – awarded by the Fletcher law faculty to the ‘outstanding student of international law’ in a given year. Other than my core specializations at Fletcher, I also cross-registered with the Harvard Law School (HLS) for a semester-long seminar on law and politics.
Accordingly, I decided to apply for the LLM thereafter. The LLM is a distinctly curated program, comprising smaller cohorts, a very close-knit community, regular exchanges with faculty and peers, periodic events and updates, and some amazing international law professors.
The career trips to New York and DC pivot away to interactions with partners from global law firms, rather than with policy thinktanks and international organizations alone, such as in the MALD. For instance, Prof. John Burgess, then partner of WilmerHale, was the Director of the LLM program during my stint there.
His insights on international M&A and cross-border financial intricacies were deeply valuable. At the same time, cross-listed faculty like Profs. Jeswald Salacuse and Ian Johnstone brought with them multi-disciplinary perspectives on investment law, arbitration, the UN, the World Bank, along with constructivist approaches and sociological constructions of the law.
The PhD, of course, is a very different animal. It’s a self-driven process, especially after you finish your coursework, clear the comprehensive exams, and defend your proposal. That’s when the real research begins, and it’s easy to get lost en route. Besides, life happens. Managing things and people in the course of the PhD – which, in a US curricular perspective, remains an immensely trying, albeit templated, process with several discrete milestones – is one of the bigger challenges.
Going through your background information, it seems you’re always up for learning something new. Even though you worked independently in the Calcutta High Court, after obtaining MALD and LLM degrees, you indulged yourself in teaching a self-designed elective course in “Law and Public Policy.” So, Deborshi, was that challenging or thrilling for you, and how?
Being from NUJS myself, I wanted to offer a course there. This was before my PhD coursework began. However, by that time I’d already decided to adopt a more ‘law and policy’ approach to work. That way, offering such a course at NUJS was a culmination of many things, including my interest in weaving together miscellaneous disciplinary paradigms into mainstream legal analysis.
How about your experience with Harvard LIDS, Boston, and working with ? What do you think is the most exciting part you would like to share with our readers regarding the same?
From the perspective of personal evolution, these stints were hugely significant, where I wanted to push myself to try new things, especially in the context of applying my learning to situations on the ground. For instance, ‘law and development’ was one of my main focus areas. Working with the Law and International Development Society (LIDS) at Harvard thus provided a great opportunity in respect of putting to use some of the theoretical constructs I’d learnt across real-life problems and circumstances. We worked with the secretariat of Transparency International about the possibility of reparations for victims of ‘grand corruption’ in international criminal proceedings.
Further, ‘international negotiation, mediation, and conflict resolution’ was one of my other specializations. I was taking a course on mediation with Prof. Eileen Babbitt. Around this time, I joined MWI, a company in Boston working in the ADR space, specializing in dispute resolution for companies through ombudsman, negotiation, consulting, arbitration, facilitation, and mediation services. I worked with instructors at the Harvard Negotiation Project of HLS, learning from their experience of negotiating with Fortune 500 clients and vendors. As part of my training, I mediated a few cases in Massachusetts district courts as well, particularly in south Boston.
Similarly, I was working with Prof. John Cerone on matters of international criminal law and humanitarian law, which culminated in representing Fletcher for the Model International Criminal Court Moot held at Krzyżowa, Poland; serving as editor for the Journal of Humanitarian Assistance; and joining the Fletcher Human Rights Practicum, pursuant to which a small group of us had the opportunity to collaborate on drafting amicus briefs for the Committee on the Elimination of Discrimination against Women (CEDAW), a body of independent experts that monitors implementation of the corresponding treaty.
This last experience came in handy because I’d already been working as Supervising Lawyer with Femin Ijtihad – Strategic Advocacy of Human Rights (SAHR) – a 501(c)(3) nonprofit organization. Accordingly, I continued working with SAHR until 2017 as its Global Legal Counsel using lessons from such experiences.
As Global Legal Counsel at SAHR, I developed best practices and drafted model laws for the purpose of legislative reform, designed judges’ and lawyers’ training workshops, and advised individuals, organizations, and local lawyers/judges in various jurisdictions, including in the US, Afghanistan, Iraq, and Nigeria.
Later, during the formative stages of my PhD, when I first got interested in the legitimacy of dispute resolution, I worked with my advisor, Prof. Salacuse – an ICSID-empanelled arbitrator and a leading expert on negotiation theory – with the Judicial Leadership Project conducted by the National Center for State Courts at the Harvard Kennedy School of Government.
I also taught a lot during this stage and worked on several consultancy, research, and training assignments, including in terms of: taking foundational classes on International Law for undergraduate students of the Political Science Department at Tufts University; teaching introductory courses on American Politics, Sociology of Race & Ethnicity, and Globalization & Social Change under the School of Arts and Sciences at Tufts University; updating Prof. Salacuse’s book on “The Law of Investment Treaties” (3rd edition) for Oxford University Press and another book on “International Business Planning: Law & Taxation (U.S.)”; coordinating and teaching a course called “Debates in Economic and Political Relations” conducted by the Horizon Academic Research Program, New York for exchange students from mainland China; and serving as coordinating instructor for the Tavitian Scholars Program in Public Policy – conducted by Fletcher for diplomats and officials from the Foreign Service of the Government of Armenia.
So far we’ve seen lawyers not focusing on their mental health because of work pressure and tight deadlines. Please shed some light on this issue, any tips that can make the situation better?
We develop our own coping mechanisms over time. If there is meaningful work to be done, there will be appurtenant pressures and timelines within which one needs to deliver. I can’t speak for others, but I like to treat work as an extension of self. Accordingly, it’s very important to me that I enjoy the work that I’m doing, to be really invested in it. When that happens, I think a couple of things coincide: you end up being better at your job, and the pressure stops being a bother. In fact, the pressure might become a thrill in itself.
I’m deeply aware that mental health is an important issue for all professionals, including for lawyers. Modern-day work ends up creating high-pressure situations for everybody. We ourselves as clients and consumers in quotidian contexts demand fast, efficient service. It’s not so much fun, perhaps, when the boot is on the other foot.
Work-life balance is what everyone talks about, presumably as an ideal. I’m not big on that myself. I don’t mean that we should sacrifice life, or the pursuit of happiness, at the altar of work. But when work goes beyond a set of itemized chores, or when work means more than something one has to do out of a sense of compulsion or duty, it starts creating a balance of its own. Life gathers around work. Personally, I like that kind of life.
If, on the other hand, work starts feeling like a lot of work – an ordeal, a terrible burden, etc. – then maybe one needs to move things around. I realize that this view reeks of some kind of privilege that many are ill afford to harbour, on account of variegated factors ranging from family, finances, health, and sundry responsibilities. Having said that, I was diagnosed with Multiple Sclerosis (MS), an incurable and debilitating autoimmune disease, in 2006 when I was in my third year of law school. At that time, I had no idea what MS was, or what to expect from it over the long-term.
I remember thinking that it sounded pretty awful when the neurologist looked at my MRI and pronounced his verdict. Some other doctors suggested that I leave studies altogether and focus on maintaining my health, let alone maintain hopes of building a career, legal or otherwise. It’s been an interesting journey ever since, for sure. I’ve had incidents of relapse during internships at JSA and NDA. I’ve been tempted to give up many times, because simple things that others take for granted, or tasks that ‘normal’ people do on an everyday basis, get very difficult to complete at times. Since I have the relapsing-remitting kind of MS, there are good days and there are bad days, and some phases of relapse, along with a progressive accumulation of disability over time.
With that qualification, however, I know that I have been very lucky to have had the kind of support from family, friends, doctors, physiotherapists, gym instructors, peers, colleagues, bosses, and employers that allowed me to continue – be it at Tufts, Fletcher, AQUILAW – where I worked during my PhD, Jindal, or S&R.
We have to reach out for support when we need it. It sounds simple, but it’s very difficult to do. This realization itself goes a long way in taking care of oneself.
We have heard that most law schools don’t focus on practical skills, and the current demands as well, what are your thoughts on the same, and how law students and other professionals can upskill their game?
I was teaching at the Jindal Global Law School before re-joining S&R Associates as Counsel. I think that educational institutions (and the wider pedagogical culture that such institutions uphold) undergo some learning over time and adapt themselves to new dynamics, especially in order to remain competitive and relevant. Compared to my time as a student, law schools these days need to, and do, focus a lot more on practical skills, including actively seeking out legal practitioners to conduct sessions where stories from the trenches are shared to give students a better idea of how things work in the real world.
At least that’s what my first-hand takeaway was, from my 3-year stint at Jindal – where as an Associate Professor, I offered courses on contract law, investment law, M&A and PE, etc. I myself used case-studies and real-life examples to familiarize students with the commercial law aspects of the courses I taught. The idea was to provide a holistic and ‘practical’ learning experience for all students. The Bar Council of India, too, has introduced various new curricular requirements that focus on such practical skills in keeping with the times.
Lastly, any 5 best pieces of advice for our readers?
I honestly doubt that my ‘advice’ will find resonance across the board. Nevertheless, here goes:
1. Make plans. These are building blocks of your future.
2. Expect said plans to go awry. Bad things happen, none of us is special. Be prepared to improvise.
3. Keep an open mind, and keep learning. Staying relevant and curious is half the battle.
4. Stick to your strengths and build on them.
5. If possible, have fun meanwhile. Life is short. No point making it more painful than it needs to be.
Disclaimer- The views and opinions expressed in this Q-A discussion are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the company they work for.
Would you like to tell our audience about what motivated you to choose law as a career?
For me becoming a lawyer meant learning about negotiation and people management, two of the really important skills to succeed in life.
Nishant, we all have our struggle stories to share, and I mean not struggle specifically but yeah the obstacles that one has to overcome, would you mind throwing light upon those?
One obstacle rather a challenging situation that I faced in my last role as an in-house counsel in the current company was leading a global project that involved folks mostly from medical background basically non-lawyers and this was difficult because we all were responsible to ensure that research trials continue without any hiccups due to this transition.
I had to make a lot of effort to understand the science behind trials , identify relevant stakeholders and also define a governance process without undermining my counterparts from medical team. This experience gave me lot of confidence to not only design & lead projects of global significance but also work across divisions and functions to achieve success.
These compliance processes have been there since a long time, but a sudden increase was noticed post-covid, what do you think can be the reasons for it?
COVID 19 created frankly a perfect storm of economic pressure and operational disruption…hackers infiltrating your network or attack against corporate data science or not using IT assets for its intended purpose/ cutting & pasting data from one application to another! In other words, pandemic created new risks that business might not have had to worry about before and impact is to an extent that these risks now exceed whatever controls you previously used.
Today the need of the hour is develop a sustainable compliance framework- one that can track/measure new risks and in parallel test and document controls as necessary, and guide remediation efforts. Most importantly, business should make proactive efforts to integrate compliance into operations because many times business change their approach/strategy without involving compliance and this means existing internal controls no longer fit their original purpose.
In post COVID 19 world this thought process is needed to stay ahead of competitors and ensuring compliance with policies.
People say in-house counsel should also have a business acumen, maybe if we can call them an “All Rounder” here, what are your views on the same Nishant?
We live in world that requires us to embrace and plan for change. Same goes for in-house counsel. The common perception was ‘legal is reactive and not proactive’. But now what I see is with time its the legal function that often bears the maximum burden of changes that companies go through…all this while coping with constant demands for greater efficiency/productivity and cost savings.
The role of the in-house lawyer has evolved into new areas such as Govt. Affairs, Audit and Compliance reporting, CSR etc… this is more than just a change of job title, it’s an acknowledgment that your in-house counsel is part of C-suite. This also conveys the strategic nature of legal function and the contribution it makes to company’s growth.
Nishant, do you think India has been following up sincerely with the GDPR regulations/privacy protocols or like me you are also of a view that it was violated during the covid times?
Data is the new currency and it only makes sense for companies to invest in protecting their data. India in my view seems to be on right track as outlook towards privacy has changed considerably in privacy space and this is largely because of a collaborative approach by govt and private companies. However to continue with this momentum we need to invest heavily in technology and associated controls to meet privacy requirements faster.
Not everyone has the ability to navigate through different regulations, but you do that so well, what are the strategies for the same that you apply constantly in your routine?
Stay informed, attend online events to keep a tab regarding changes in regulations. Some online/in person conferences can really provide useful insights. Subscribe to blogs and newsletters. Join industry associations, its a great way to stay connected with changes in your field.
How do you maintain the work-life balance Nishant?
I actually like to term it as work-life integration because this will bring several aspects of work life such as work, family, well-being under same roof. I can choose to manage personal tasks during work hours and vice Versa. The biggest plus I see with this approach is flexibility eg. allowing me coordinate my schedule and responsibilities more productively.
Let tips in my experience:
a) Learn to say no- very important part of setting boundaries
b) ask for flexibility- open conversation about your needs vs. your employer/team needs can lead to win-win scenario
c) make space in your schedule for family time
d) always remember your work and managers can wait but your friends/family and personal milestones will not.
Nishant, being a mentor yourself, please give a few pieces of advice for our readers?
Mentorship does not have to be a formal process but in our field it’s a crucial form of support for budding lawyers/law school students. Its important to recognise that a mentee places a lot of trust so a mentor should take out time of their schedule to help mentee develop and grow. But its equally important that mentee also assumes responsibility for learning because a mentor can only give you tools and guidance.
Lastly recognize that the mentor maybe phenomenal but will have a limit to the knowledge and abilities, its important to not get upset or disappointed because your mentor cannot answer all questions but make the most of their time and knowledge in areas where they can.
Being a 6th Generation Pharmacist, a lawyer, writer and podcast host. How has this journey been for you?
I lived in India for the first half of my life and pursued my higher secondary education from St. Xaviers University and secondary school from Green Lawns. Post that, I went to the US and pursued community college at the age of 18, whereby I completed 2 years of community college in 1 year by completing the requirement of 60 credits. I simultaneously applied to Pharmacy and Business School but ended up going to pharmacy school. While pursuing my education, I also handled 14 jobs simultaneously, so I have done everything from working as a pharmacy technician to creating the website for the social science department at my university to running the local domain for my university.
I completed my Doctor of Pharmacy degree at the age of 22 and then went back to get my Juris Doctor degree at 25. I also completed my Masters in Quality Assurance/ Regulatory Affairs while simultaneously clerking for a Federal Court Judge, the Hon. Clifford Scott Greene, in the Eastern District, Pennsylvania. He was an absolutely wonderful judge from whom I learned a lot about legal nuances. During this time, I realized that I had a creative and business side and got interested in podcasting while juggling between being a pharmacist and a lawyer. Early in my career, I was the corporate counsel for a pharmaceutical company based out of Edison, New Jersey. I also wrote a couple of book chapters and taught at the University of Sciences, where I taught Health Law, Bioethics, Drug Advertising, and Regulatory Documents. I have also guest lectured at the University of Colorado, Drexel School of Engineering, Temple School of Pharmacy, Temple Law, the University of Florida and the University of Southern California. I look forward to teaching for the Law department of Drexel University pretty soon. I have also been the Chair of the Life Sciences interest group for the American Bar Association. My journey has been exciting and has been led with the purpose to learn as many things as possible.
You decided to pursue J.D. at Temple University after having hands-on experience in practising pharmacy at few of the most reputable institutes in the world such as Albert Einstein Medical Center and John Hopkins University as an instructor on Pharmacology and Toxicology. Considering the differences between law and pharmacy, did you face any impediments while transitioning from two very unrelated disputes?
To address your question, you are referring to two eras of my life: the pre-pharmacy one and the pharmacy one. In my pre-pharmacy career, I taught at Hopkins in their Centre for Talented Youth program. When I was teaching them, I was 20 years old, and my intern was 3 years older than me. At Einstein Medical Centre, it was my first experience as a hospital pharmacist, and I learnt a lot about how hospitals work. I spent over 10 years working at the Thomas Jefferson Hospital and mainly worked in pharmacy settings.
To answer your question on how I transitioned to law, I believe that all businesses run on three aspects: technical, legal, and business. As a 6th generation pharmacist and having done pharmacy, I understood the technical aspects. Having studied accounts in India, I understood the business aspect; while completing my JD in law, I also started understanding the legal aspects and got a holistic view of the profession.
Post law school, you worked as a Clerk to the Honourable Clifford Scott Green who was one of the most well-regarded judges in the Eastern Pennsylvania district. Please tell us about the experience of working under a federal judge, who had popularly presided over a 26-year old case that ended institutional racism in the Pennsylvania State Police?
The Judge I worked for was incredibly smart and taught me a lot. He taught me the virtue of patience. As a youngster, I was always curious to know many things. At the same time, he taught me to focus on what question I was trying to answer, which helped me understand that we focus intently on the answer most of the time rather than focusing our energy on the question.
Your firm, Kulkarni Law Firm, focuses on helping U.S. Food & Drug Administration (FDA)-regulated companies successfully promote their products. From clinical trials, advertising and marketing, to drug dispensing. Can you throw some light on how Kulkarni Law Firm is an epitome of a new age industry aimed at creating a positive impact at large in the pharma marketing space?
What makes things work for us is that I look at everything from a patient-centric viewpoint. I stand by the philosophy that in the end, it’s about helping the patient, and if you aren’t helping the patient then you really haven’t achieved anything. My idea is never to think about how we can “get past” the FDA, but I believe we have met the spirit of the law and hence in the process, we help the patients. So, the answer in simpler terms would be I try to teach companies to meet compliance requirements of the FDA through regulatory strategies so that in the end, the patient’s goals can be met.
You work on U.S. Food and Drug Administration (FDA) regulatory compliance. You have also been involved as a member of various State Bar Associations. What are the existing system loopholes in the over-regulated Pharma industry of the US, that you are aiming to address through your work to promote public health?
I believe that conversations about public health must be held in a way to educate patients. A simple example would be podcasting or hosting a session on Instagram whereby you educate the consumer as to why they must take charge of their own health and steps to undertake such measures. This will help in understanding things from a patient-centric view. I use non-traditional means to reach out to people. I believe in digitally educating people because people who rely on their doctors completely don’t have any other means to find out what they or their loved ones are consuming. Hence, you won’t realize the importance of having these conversations on a virtual platform unless you lose someone to a bad prescription or medicines.
The first episode of Darshan Talks dates back to July 2019, titled “Art of the Possible”. The latest episode is on Pharma marketers embracing electronic Continuing Medical Education and its scope post covid, all of these topics are extremely engaging and provide real-life insights on otherwise dreaded topics. How has your journey been for the past 2 years? If you could invite any guest from the legal or pharma world, who would it be?
It hasn’t been difficult to find guests because I often talk to my friends, and believe me, I have a guest list completely chalked three months into the future into January. On-boarding guests for me has not been difficult as I end up using my network. Once they have done the podcast with me, I call them again post 2-3 months and hence I have a rotating list which gives me the added advantage of not having to come up with new guests all the time. I also try to reach out to people interested in life sciences. When I approach them, I don’t decide on a topic or anything but try and convince them to have a conversation, making the guest feel comfortable, allowing me to ask as many questions as possible. This has largely been my secret to success, so I have guests coming back because all I ask for is a simple conversation with no agenda in mind.
In response to the need for the COVID-19 vaccine, multiple pharmaceutical companies ventured with institutes and universities to develop effective vaccines. Do you think in the 21st century, we could have handled this better?
I believe that with reference to the pandemic, we had plans, but we did not execute them correctly. We could have definitely made better plans, but I also know that people working at the highest levels tried their best. I also believe that we executed well by introducing a vaccine within a year. Tons of research have gone into the same, and for the people who are resisting the vaccine as it is still in the trial stage, I must say that a lot of research has gone into the same, and we are bouncing back well.
You have penned several articles and research papers on thoroughly incorporating medical science with technology, whether it’s A.I. or telemedicine, cannabis from an expert’s viewpoint and spreading awareness among the masses. What are the trends you expect to be emerging in the pharma industry in the US and across the globe?
I believe that a couple of different things are going to happen. Though the move towards the digital space will not stop, digital companies will need to adapt to healthcare instead of looking to “disrupt” it. An excellent example of this would be Apple announcing to close its healthcare division as it is a space they don’t want to be a part of. So instead of technology companies leading the way in Pharma, Pharma companies will actually teach technology companies how it is done. The same will happen in the next five years when these companies will come back and consolidate their efforts. I also believe that these companies will build mini-projects in the short term and then reconsolidate.
Another thing we will see a lot of is biohacking, where people who have completed their PhDs or their Masters degrees are busy with their research work. This seems to be a growing area whereby they are hacking themselves by putting chips in their bodies rather than hacking computers.
Stem cell research may also grow over the years, where people are trying to cure various diseases such as Parkinson’s or cancer. While the question can be answered in a thousand ways because people’s minds plunge towards multiple areas, the next 20 years will be extremely interesting to find answers to the questions.
What would be your advice to anyone who aims to educate people on pharmacies through digital content?
My first advice would be to do it. But on a more serious note, I would push people to double-check their sources as I have encountered many people who give legal and financial advice without possessing the required knowledge. The issue is not whether one can learn, but the issue is primarily what one is learning. Another thing that exists inside every individual is bias. We were taught in law school that anyone who says I don’t have a bias is incorrect because our circumstances and situations define our bias. People interested in gathering limited knowledge scares me as they want to play in the safe zone. Hence the answer would be to educate by knowing all the facts and double-checking the same. Also, with respect to bias, it would be to either address it or learn from it. If you go on to ignore your bias, it will not benefit you in the long run.
In one of your interviews you have mentioned, Google is one of your favourite companies for their desire to innovate. As the Principal Attorney at Kulkarni Law Firm, how do you encourage innovation and personal growth for your team?
One of the primary ways I instil innovation is to encourage people working with me to work with other people. This helps people understand other people and guides them about different working styles and different methods. Subject to confidentiality requirements, if you can deliver on the work given to you by me, I would never stop you from working with whoever you feel like.
What would be your advice to all the people who want to venture into various areas of practice? In your words for people who think about (medical drugs), wonder about devices and obsess about pharmacy?
I believe that individuals should do what they feel and should venture into something which is their calling. People in life should find their Ikigai or Junoon, as they call it in Hindi. If you have heard the song “who’s stopping you”, it really speaks to me. So, if mental health is your purpose, go study about it. The world must not tell you what to do; you should do as you feel like. As in movies and songs, you are restricting yourself from doing what you feel like by blaming some higher power, which is just an excuse. I said before, do as you feel like and on your terms – as long as you are willing to live with the consequences.
